Curry Recipes Online
Beginners Guide => Trainee Chefs / Beginners Questions => Topic started by: pat_mustard on November 19, 2012, 10:54 AM
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Hi all,
I'm pretty new to all this and have been given different advise on how to add the powdered spices. A lot of what I've read tells you to add the powdered spices dry but I've also been told that the best way is to mix them with water first to prevent them burning . Anyone got any thoughts on which way gives the best results .
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Hi all,
I'm pretty new to all this and have been given different advise on how to add the powdered spices. A lot of what I've read tells you to add the powdered spices dry but I've also been told that the best way is to mix them with water first to prevent them burning . Anyone got any thoughts on which way gives the best results .
I think that the key is to add them (dry) to cold oil in a cold pan (assuming that you intended to bhoon them), then raise the temperature gently, keep them in motion, and be ready to quench them with either a ladle or less of base or a mixture of tomato puree and water (1:2) when you need to arrrest the cooking. The quenching should take place when there had been a colour change, gas is being given off, and there is a pleasant smell of roast spices coming from the pan; smoke is a definite sign that you have possible gone too far ... !
** Phil.
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Thanks for the reply Phil, not sure what you mean by "bhoon them" though.
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Thanks for the reply Phil, not sure what you mean by "bhoon them" though.
Ah, sorry, I should have explained myself better : there are many different definitions of "to bhoon / bhoona / bhunao", but what I meant in this context is to cook them gently in oil to release their essential oils.
** Phil.
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hi pat i all ways make a paste with water to the dry spices a tad thiner than tom paste outa of the tube works for me ( ivan :) )
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i use 1 chef of base and mix it all together in the pan (the spice, tom puree, base etc). i find this gives 100% consistency.
link http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=2968.0 (http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=2968.0)
http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=1283.0 (http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=1283.0)
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If you use the Taz base (which has a high oil content) then the spices go into the hot base in your pan at the same time at the tomato paste (tomato puree diluted with water). The spices fry but the liquid in the base and tomato paste lessens the chances of them being burnt.
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Another way pat_mustard
Hot Ali Pan, Hot Oil, sizzle of G&G,Tomato Puree Dilute, Dry Powdered Spices
sizzle and burn slightly, a ladle of base to loosen it all up. Tarka/Bhagar done.
Then in with the main event and your base and your cooking.
The key to learning this BIR method, is to have all your ingredients laid out in front of you and develop a rhythm and feel for what your doing.
If you have to take your eye off the ball and look for an ingredient, you've lost.
It really can make the difference between a Curry and an Excellent Curry.
cheers Chewy
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Thanks for all the replies, from all the different methods it seem you can get good results as long as you dont burn the spices, lots to learn yet! :)
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Another way pat_mustard
Hot Ali Pan, Hot Oil, sizzle of G&G,Tomato Puree Dilute, Dry Powdered Spices
sizzle and burn slightly, a ladle of base to loosen it all up. Tarka/Bhagar done.
Then in with the main event and your base and your cooking.
The key to learning this BIR method, is to have all your ingredients laid out in front of you and develop a rhythm and feel for what your doing.
If you have to take your eye off the ball and look for an ingredient, you've lost.
It really can make the difference between a Curry and an Excellent Curry.
cheers Chewy
I agree 100 percent - look for something and then its curtains - start again!
best, Rich
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This is something that's been puzzling me as of late. For example, I was under the impression that I needed to throw in the spices when the oil would be hot. I've occasionally got the smoke blast when I did it, which suggests I was burning the spices rather than cooking them properly. However, how do the chefs manage to throw in spices in those industrial stoves with massive amounts of heat and not manage them to burn? dipuraja1 or julian as examples that come to mind
On another note, would you advice to mix the spices altogether or just add one by one? because before I start cooking, I generally have all the veggies separate and cut and then all the spice parts mixed in a container which is shakened to mix properly before thrown into a pan with g&g-oil and (depending on dish) tomato puree (or paste)
So any more insight on this would be greatly welcome before I ago about making my next curry :)
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gagomes,
i can relate exactly to what you say. i spent i think something like 3 months trying to master the hot fry and in the end ditched it for adding a chef of base (or tom puree in water you just need free water).
i did some heating of whole spice this last year which told me what i suppose i already knew - there is a very fine line between singe and burn. at 100C your fine but at 120C the spice will burn.
how do BIR's do it - i think taking the pan off the heat to add the spice is key. i do it even "wet" frying. i also give it all a good stir before returning to the heat. how they detect the change i can only think is somehow down to sight (i've not been able to detect anything) - i can't smell on a hot burner although i could smell the "toffee" smell on my domestic hob. it can only be down to judgement from repetition.
i mix all the spice together. my sequence being 1 chef of base, tom puree, spice, stir
links:
spice frying: http://cr0.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=2968.0 (http://cr0.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=2968.0)
method: http://cr0.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=1283.0 (http://cr0.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=1283.0)
smoke: http://cr0.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=1851.msg30081#msg30081 (http://cr0.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=1851.msg30081#msg30081)
chef garam / oil: http://cr0.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=8347.0 (http://cr0.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=8347.0)
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pat / gagomes, this is the routine I follow for a Madras which was shown me by the chef at our favourite t/a and is very similar to chewy's post above.
Prepare and have to hand all the ingredients you need for the curry you are making.
Line them up in order of using next to the hob so as you add the ingredient move the just used ingredient to the back then on to the next ingredient ( hope that makes sense ::))
1, place pan on medium heat
2, add veg oil to pan enough to cover the bottom of the pan
3, add a pinch of dried methi leaves and wait for them to start sizzling
4, add a heaped teaspoon of garlic/ginger puree (50/50 mixture) and stir vigorously , when g/g stops sizzling remove pan from heat .
5, add 3 tablespoons of watered down tomato puree ( consistency of tomato ketchup )
6, add spice mix and chili powder
7, back on heat and stir vigorously, continue to stir until a toffee like aroma is noticed.
8, add precooked meat and stir in coating the meat,add some base gravy if the mixture is becoming dry.
9, add first ladle of gravy stir in and turn up the heat to a high but manageable level.
10, keep stirring until the mixture has ' cooked down ' and become a thicker consistency.
11, add second ladle of gravy and stir
12, add salt to taste (approx 1/4 - 1/2 level teaspoon ) and stir
13, add a large pinch of finely chopped fresh coriander and stir
14, add third ladle of gravy and stir keeping heat up
15, add a squirt of lemon dressing
16, add a small pinch of garam massala ( optional )
17, continue to stir on lower heat and simmer for a couple of minutes ( covered with a gauze splatter guard if available ) oil should start to show on the surface of the curry.
18, serve into dish garnish with fresh coriander.
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JerryM, emin-j: Thank you!
I think your posts complement each other and paint the exact picture I needed, thank you very much indeed :)
I will even try this recipe for madras with a bit of taz base tomorrow, as today I didn't nail it proper (though I followed stephen lindsay's recipe, which suggests that you start with a laddle of base gravy, instead of preheating oil in the pan. Taz base has plenty of oil, so it's a close enough.) -- as I added too much chili, I had to fix it with a teaspoon of sugar and a teaspoon of pataks mango chutney. The end result was chicken mango, so not totally lost 8)
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gagomes, the Taz base has high oil content so you could probably start with a chef spoon of base rather than oil, or you could end up with a pool of oil on the top of your curry ;D ;)
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pat / gagomes, this is the routine I follow for a Madras which was shown me by the chef at our favourite t/a and is very similar to chewy's post above.
Almost identical to my own, except (a) I have never tried adding methi leaves that early, and (b) I cook my g/g at a lower temperature so I never get to the "when g/g stops sizzling" stage (i.e., it doesn't really sizzle in the first place).
** Phil.
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pat / gagomes, this is the routine I follow for a Madras which was shown me by the chef at our favourite t/a and is very similar to chewy's post above.
Almost identical to my own, except (a) I have never tried adding methi leaves that early, and (b) I cook my g/g at a lower temperature so I never get to the "when g/g stops sizzling" stage (i.e., it doesn't really sizzle in the first place).
** Phil.
Hi Phil,
Do you blend your g/g with a small amount of oil and water ? It's the frying out of the water that causes the sizzling.
atb.
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Do you blend your g/g with a small amount of oil and water ? It's the frying out of the water that causes the sizzling.
No water, just oil : I had always assumed (perhaps wrongly) that water would encourage it to go off, whereas oil would tend to preserve it (I do keep things forever if I can !).
** Phil.
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This is strange since I do the same as Phil ie. only blend with oil and my g/g sizzles like crazy when I put it in ... I wait for that moment when it stops sizzling to tell me it's done otherwise I would have no idea and more than likely burn it ;)
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It may be that your oil is already hot, Colin, whilst mine is (quite intentionally) still cool.
** Phil.
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Do you blend your g/g with a small amount of oil and water ? It's the frying out of the water that causes the sizzling.
No water, just oil : I had always assumed (perhaps wrongly) that water would encourage it to go
Not if you freeze the stuff ;)