Curry Recipes Online
Curry Base Recipes => Curry Sauce, Curry Base , Curry Gravy Recipes, Secret Curry Base => Topic started by: pete on February 14, 2005, 12:55 PM
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I arrived an hour early and the wind was freezing
I found Brick Lane easily, it?s only an eight minute walk from Aldgate East tube station.
I negotiated the area in an attempt to kill time.
Although these parts of London have a certain earthy charm, I must admit, that I permanently felt like a potential mugging victim.
Eventually I decided to call on Bengal Cuisine , a little earlier than planned.
The restaurant has a roomy clean atmosphere.
Very pleasant.
Everything had been arranged by e mail, and I needed to meet my contact, Sharif.
Within five minutes I was eating a complimentary poppadom with four chutney accompaniments.
Soon after I was led down some steps to the basement.
This is where their kitchen is situated.
There is a long, central, stainless steel table which spans nearly the length of the room.
Vegetables, prawns and takeaway cartons are all placed here.
The gas cooker and the tandoor run parallel to the table.
I expected to see a grinder for the curry gravy, but was surprised by a conventional jug blender instead.
I saw it used as well.
The cooker had about ten gas rings and there was newspaper sheets placed underneath them.
Probably to catch the spraying oil!
Above the cooker were many well used blackened pots, pans and woks.
On the cooker was large pot of the fabled curry gravy.
It?s dark, red oil floating on top.
The chef dropped a ladle to the bottom of it?s pot, and a bright yellow sauce broke the surface.
It was like a thin soup.
He smiled at my surprised expression.
As usual, next to the stove were the yoghurt cartons full of the curry additions.
The layout was:-
Salt, garam masala, ground almond, curry powder, chilli powder,chopped garlic,turmeric, sliced almonds, dried fenugreek, chopped fresh coriander, sliced chilli and coconut powder.
I had asked to see curry gravy made and I wanted to see a prawn rhogan josh cooked
And so ,with several staff observing, the demonstration began!
The Onion Gravy
Ingredients:-
2 large onions sliced
1 green pepper sliced
1 medium potato sliced
3 tablespoons Garlic ginger puree
1 carrot unpeeled chopped
1 cup of vegetable oil
? cup vegetable ghee
1 desertspoon salt
2 desertspoon turmeric
2 desertspoon of Pataks Kashmiri Masala
2 green chillies chopped
2 whole tomatoes from a can
Water equal to half the volume of the above
i.e. if the above comes to half way up the pot, then add a quarter of a pot of water
Boil the above for only ten minutes.
This is until you can see the sliced onion wilting
Now add:-
2 desertspoons of curry powder (rajah)
2 desertspoons of ground almonds
2 desertspoons of coconut powder
2 tablespoons of condensed milk
Cook another five minutes and then blend
The mixture is bright yellow
Add enough hot water to make it very runny
About half it?s volume again
This doesn?t look like your finished oily curry gravy but I was told with more oil, and longer cooking, it would.
As far as the chef was concerned, we had what we wanted.
Prawn Rhogan Josh
This is made using two pans
An 8 inch pan is used for the prawn part
A 5 inch pan is used for a sauce
The sauce is poured over the prawns at the finish
Ingredients:-
3 desert spoons of oil
1 tablespoon of finely chopped garlic
1 tablespoon finely chopped onion
? desertspoon tomato puree
1 teaspoon salt
1 desertspoon curry powder (rajah)
2 cups full of thawed cooked prawns
Add everything to the pan (except the prawns) in the order listed and shake vigorously and stir fry for about two minutes
Add the prawns and stir fry, shaking the pan.
The pan is kept very dry
Stir fry a couple of minutes more
Add a ladle of the curry gravy
Shake the pan
Stir fry till evaporated then add another ladle of curry gravy.
Put on simmer and stir from time to time
Total cooking time is about ten minutes.
The pan ends up being fairly dry
Five minutes from the end of the above, start cooking this sauce
This is cooked in a smaller pan (5 inch)
Ingredients 1:-
3 tablespoons of oil
1 desertspoon tomato puree
1 teaspoon salt
1 desert spoon curry powder (rajah)
Add the above to a pan and shake and stir vigorously
Cook for about two minutes then add
Ingredients 2:-
1 ladle of curry gravy
1 large tomato sliced in rings
Stir fry until the sauce dries a bit
Add another ladle of curry gravy, a pinch of dried fenugreek and some finely chopped coriander.
Simmer
Total cooking time is about five minutes.
Pour this sauce over the prawn curry cooked previously and serve.
Conclusion:-
This was a really worthwhile experience, and if I lived closer, I would do this again, very soon.
I have seen Kashmiri Masala on a few curry house shelves, but never heard of it being used in the curry gravy
That was a real eye opener
Dylan has used potato in his curry base, he was right!
I have never tried using ground almonds or coconut powder, either.
The curry gravy I saw made had a much fresher flavour to it.
I prefer the old ?boiled for hours? taste but I don?t think that comment would have been understood.
The curry itself, ironically lacked ?the flavour? we talk of, and had a home made feel.
I believe that this again, is down to the curry base being too fresh.
I have had this before in restaurants
You get it sometimes if you buy a curry on a Sunday when the main Curry gravy has only just been prepared.
Conversation is also very limited, due to language problems.
Two people speak English very well, but not the chef.
His English is minimal
So, fine cooking details, are not easy to clarify.
But you can see it done, and that does more than any words!
Everybody involved was extremely helpful and pleasant.
I would recommend anyone to go.
If you know very little, then it will help you.
If you know a lot, then you will know more.
Could ayone else that goes add to this thread, so we can build up some genuine recipes?
It's well worth ?25
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Hi Pete,
Would you say that it was a better curry than you made before using your own gravy etc...?
cK
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Superb Pete, well done
I should be viewing the chef at my local restaurant this week so I will report back anything I find.
How was the prawn rogan josh?
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Hi Pete,
Some more questions:
About the sauce:
When you say cup was this a rough measure or 250ml ?
Sure it was vegetable ghee and not animal ghee (vegetable ghee smells foul!)
About the prawn rhogan josh:
Was the oil off the curry gravy?
When the first ladle was evaporated did he get rid of absolutely all the moisture added ?
cheers!
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Pete,
Excellent post the best so far. ;)
I will make this a sticky so people can add to it as we build up more real life experience.
Here are the details if anyone else fancies a go;
BENGAL CUISINE
12 Brick Lane London, E1 6RF
Reservation: 020 7377 8405
www..bengalcuisine.net (http://www..bengalcuisine.net)
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Hi Pete
Well done again! Did they have recipes all typed out for you and if not, did they mind you copying down as you went. I must say though, it might have been easier to have chosen maybe a vindaloo to check out it authenticity (restaurant flavour) I will certainly try this one though
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Replies:-
CK :
It was a better all round curry from a composition point of view.
But I felt it lacked "the" flavour
I think that was because the base was too new and they hadn't browned garlic ginger puree at the start of making it.
Mark:
See above. A cup was probably about 200ml.
He said it was vegetable ghee but his english was limited.
Maybe it was butter ghee.
The oil was NOT from the top of the curry gravy.
It was from an old ghee container balanced on the stove.
If he had used the old curry gravy and oil from it, I am sure it would have been a better curry.
When he fried with the curry gravy he evaporated just about all of it.
Curryqueen:
They offered a clipboard with A4 sheets for notes, but I had a book of my own.
They expect you to take notes
They give no typed notes
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Hi Pete, I am going to have a go at this, but, I am going to use the gravy from the Tandoori magazine seeing as I have just made a batch end of last week. I am sure that "the flavour" will be there if the oil from the gravy is used, I can almost smell it now.
How many tablespoons do you think made up their ladle they used?
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Hi Pete, I am going to have a go at this, but, I am going to use the gravy from the Tandoori magazine seeing as I have just made a batch end of last week. I am sure that "the flavour" will be there if the oil from the gravy is used, I can almost smell it now.
How many tablespoons do you think made up their ladle they used?
Probably about four tablespoons.
If that's too much, you can always pour a bit away at the end.
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Another question Pete.
During the cooking process did they tip the pan and set light to the oil? If you were to go again to the Bengali, just out of interest, what would your next dish be cook? I think I would have to try the "vindaloo" one of my fave's!
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Another question Pete.
During the cooking process did they tip the pan and set light to the oil? If you were to go again to the Bengali, just out of interest, what would your next dish be cook? I think I would have to try the "vindaloo" one of my fave's!
They shake the pan all the time.
There are little bursts of flames as they do this.
And yes, I would like to see a Vindaloo or Madras made
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Wow Pete that was absolutely fascinating, thanks for sharing!
Will you make the recipe again and cook the gravy for far longer, brown garlic etc, it would be interesting to see if that would give it 'the taste'. I would love to visit there if I lived nearer!
I know what you mean about Sunday curries lacking 'the' flavour. I sometimes go to our local sunday all you can eat buffet, and while the food is nice enough and fresh tasting, it's not like a usual takeaway, it's more a home-cooked taste and not really anything that I couldn't do myself. It's still a nice way to spend a couple of hours on a sunday though!
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I have just made the Rhogan Josh that Pete posted and it is great! I used gravy that was made last Friday and has been in the fridge and also the oil from the top of the gravy. This curry does not taste homemade and with the addition of some fresh chillies has given it a nice heat. I must admit that Rhogan Josh is not a dish that I usually have, but, has certainly tantilised my tastebuds today and will probably order in the future.
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I have just made the Rhogan Josh that Pete posted and it is great! I used gravy that was made last Friday and has been in the fridge and also the oil from the top of the gravy. This curry does not taste homemade and with the addition of some fresh chillies has given it a nice heat. I must admit that Rhogan Josh is not a dish that I usually have, but, has certainly tantilised my tastebuds today and will probably order in the future.
I'm really pleased that it turned out well.
I ill be cooking it myself at the week end
I would expect that the two pan method of cooking a curry is used a lot.
I've been looking at a menu and seen? Bhuna? described as prepared with "fresh onions,capsicums and tomatoes"
So that would be done in two pans
One for the main ingredient then one for the sauce and extras.
I'd love to go to Bengal Cuisine again, but it cost a small fortune.
I paid ?25 for the course then ?29 travel.
The journey totalled about five hours as well.
I'm really hoping someone else will go from this forum, then post their findings.
Someone must live near London
Let's see a Madras, Vindaloo or whatever!!
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Great job, Pete!? Not only did you offer a lot information, your first paragraph really captured the feeling of the place.
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Hi Pete, you mention in your piece that they used coconut powder. Is this different from dessicated coconut? If so, where might I get it. (I have tried whizzing up dessicated coconut to a fine powder and it failed miserably.)
Good thread by-the-way.
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Hi Pete, you mention in your piece that they used coconut powder. Is this different from dessicated coconut? If so, where might I get it. (I have tried whizzing up dessicated coconut to a fine powder and it failed miserably.)
This is a bit of a mystry.
I have never seen this form of coconut
It wasn't dessicated coconut
It wasn't coconut milk powder
It looks exactly like ground almonds, but white.
You can buy just the insides?of coconuts.
I've seen that in Asian shops.
Maybe they grind that.
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Thanks Pete,
I'll try asking my Asian grocer.
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Hi Pete/Dylan,
It is coconut flour. I have some and use it in place of coconut powder sometimes. It does have the appearance of ground almonds, but, is white in colour. You can buy it in any Asian grocers.
Anyone else booked the Begal yet, or maybe contemplating it possibly in the future?
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Hi,
I'm booked to go on the course at the beggning of March. Meal of choice will be a Chicken Tikka Pathia. I'll report back what I find...
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Hi Pete,
Did you make your Rhogan Josh? How did it turn out? I am glad to see that someone has booked to go the the Bengal, perhaps I might book it myself.
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Hi Pete,
Did you make your Rhogan Josh? How did it turn out? I am glad to see that someone has booked to go the the Bengal, perhaps I might book it myself.
I couldn't make it last Saturday but I will post the results when I give it a go.
I hope that loads of people go on that cooking course.
It is really difficult to get into takeaway kitchens, so this is a golden opportunity.
I have offered money at several places round me and I think the language problem is the main stumbling block.
They don't seem to understand what you want to do
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Many thanks for pointing out this golden opportunity. I hope to go myself. On their web site, they say it's a group lesson. Was there a kitchen full of visitors at the time of your visit?
Also, how certain are you that the methods shown are the ones used to produce their in-house curries, rather than other recipes or modifications which they may be more inclined to divulge?
Regards
George
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They don't seem to understand what you want to do
Pete
I'm note sure we should let on what we want to do. Perhaps its better to avoid telling them that for years we've been searching for the holy grail, after their trade secrets. I don't mean to open restaurants in competition or anything, but just to do more cooking at home with less need to buy take-aways from them.
Regards
George
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On their web site, they say it's a group lesson. Was there a kitchen full of visitors at the time of your visit?
Also, how certain are you that the methods shown are the ones used to produce their in-house curries, rather than other recipes or modifications which they may be more inclined to divulge?
Regards
George
When I went, it was just me but normally there are three of four people.
I was in a rush to catch trains back home (120 miles away) .This did spoil it a little.
I am 100% certain, the recipes I was shown, are the? methods used by other restaurants
There will be variations between chefs, but these are the basics.
One of the most important things is the evaporation of the curry gravy from the meal
This really concentrates the flavour, and can only be done, by adding a little curry gravy at a time
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Pete
just made your Rogon Josh and it was superb.
i made the base with the addition of 6 radishes and 2 pieces of celery as that is how I was told to do it before.
The base turns out to be a concentrate of yellow puree.
I took two ladels of this and watered this down by about 3/4 to one and let it cook. As it cooks it gains a redness on the top.
I followed the rogan recipe but with tikka chicken and not prawns and it was excellent. totally restaurant like and not homemade.
I cut down on the salt though as I dont like salty food and i thought 2 teaspoons in total looked rather a lot.
Of note I used tomato paste from the indian grocer. you can get a 50ml tin for 20 p and is ideal.
It gives a much better flavour..
I felt this paste was far better than puree and is not as concentrated. It seems to cook in the oil without curdling which I have found with the tubed stuff.
I think the restaurant have shown you the correct method and techniques and the evaporating of the gravy is essential to the flavour.
thanks
paul
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...I cut down on the salt though as I don't like salty food and I thought 2 teaspoons in total looked rather a lot.
With the greatest respect, it seems highly plausible that the restaurants use at least this much salt - our health isn't their greatest concern, any more than all the salt in supermarket foods, starting with bread and butter.
So, by reducing the salt you may never achieve your presumed goal of matching take-away curries. Better to leave it in for test and research purposes, and then modify the recipe later for everyday use. Just add back all the salt when your friends come round for dinner!
Also, if you are (rightly) concerned about all the salt - and ultra high levels of fat, actually - will you never again eat in an Indian restaurant or get a take-away?
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Thanks for your concern.
i cut dont the salt as i used tikka chicken cooked and heavily marinaded with pataks tikka paste and yoghurt.
this is already heavily salted so i cut it down to 1 teaspoon and it was fine.
and an excellent curry infact - just like the restaurant.
you are right salt is a definite requirement along with lots of oil.
i tend to use khyber vegetable ghee which apart from being odourless is 100% cholestrol free and is what they use in the
restaurants by me.
paul
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I have now made both the base sauce and the Rogan Josh I was shown.
Very successful.
These recipes are genuine, and if we can keep getting stuff like this, this site will be amazing.
I bet you all our recipes will get copied and used all over the internet.
We'll probably see a new "e book" on ebay, with all our work in
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I can see it now "Secrets of the in2curry restaurant chefs revealed!". Worth 30 quid of anyones money ;)
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Ive just made this Rogan Josh with chicken, I really like the idea of the 2 stage approach.
I didnt use this base (used the 600ml oil one with chick stock, by the way this base sauce with chicken stock cold has the smell of that taste in it). I didnt use curry powder either, I used pataks kashmiri paste instead, my initial tasting says ive overdone it on the spices (I cooked this for 2 so doubled up on the spices which was about 3 desert spoons of the paste).
I have cooked it in advance so havent eaten it yet (of course! ;D), Ill eat it in a few hours and report back
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It was a very nice curry but I did over spice it, it had that slightly bitter taste that curries can get with pataks if you over do it, my missus said it was superb though!
Served with mango & chilli chutney and a cucumber and mint raita from Madhur Jaffreys ultimate curry bible (a book I highly recommend)
I will try it again without the paste
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I use the pataks pastes for marinades and they are very good.
I find if they go into a curry, they give a gritty texture.
When I use them for the curry gravy this "grit" softens because I leave the gravy a day before using.
I'm doing the "Bengal Cuisine" prawn rhogan josh tonight.
When you cook with two pans, it feels very professional!
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What happened to this thread, it seems to contain the holy grail we've searched for but no-one appears to be using this base anymore.
I only found it by accident while searching for a recipe for raita.
I'd be interested to know why this base has lost it's appeal.
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There is nothing wrong with this, or Curry Queens and Grimmo's demo at the same place.
There was disappointment that the base lacked the "taste"
But they all do, unless you use "old oil" tecniques
Perhaps a problem of this site, is that there is too much information
I shall be making this base again
It was a really enjoyable demo, although a round trip of 240 miles!
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Has anyone tried, this base? You got to remember this came from a real curry house down brick lane who let you have a lesson for ?20, and it seems sometimes when you look at old threads they start to make more sense now as your experience grows.
This could be one to try if you have not already.
Stew
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Stew thanks for reminding me of that one. It's topical for me because I want to concentrate on bases that are very light in colour, assuming of course that a bright yellow base is allowed by the cr0-curry-chromaticity-gestapo that is.
I've had several madrases which have been a bright orange colour and the sauce is almost see through. It intrigues me how they manage this and yet still produce a full flavour. It's so different from the regular brown curry. So, yes, I'm going to give this one and probably vinda looo's a go next.
Actually I feel guilty for not trying it before now since pete made such efforts to get it posted.
YF