Curry Recipes Online
British Indian Restaurant Recipes - Main Dishes => BIR Main Dishes Chat => Topic started by: gazman1976 on February 09, 2014, 07:45 PM
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Why is it that I can make a perfect Korma identical in every way to BIR but still cant replicate a Madras ( something missing ) its really annoying me now - anyone else experiencing this?
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Gaz, have you tried Chewy's Madras? I think it's spot on. I use his base recipe as well.
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No, I actually bought a pressure cooker and made a base 2 weeks ago, still not done chewys as of yet, u think its 100% then?
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No, I actually bought a pressure cooker and made a base 2 weeks ago, still not done chewys as of yet, u think its 100% then?
I think it's as good as I remember, it hits the spot with me. Although, as we know, it's a regional thing, and, of course, technique plays a major part.
Cheers,
Ken
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No, I actually bought a pressure cooker and made a base 2 weeks ago, still not done chewys as of yet, u think its 100% then?
I think it's as good as I remember, it hits the spot with me. Although, as we know, it's a regional thing...
It certainly is. CT's madras was not only the worst madras I've ever made it also ranked close to the worst curry I've ever made. If I ever find some MDH kashmiri powder I intend to make it again to see if this brand really does make all the difference.
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I think you must've cocked it up SS. There's no way a simple curry like a CT madras can be called "worst curry ever made" unless the chef making it screwed up cooking of the dish. It's no more than a medium curry with a few shakes of Lea & Perrins and lemon juice at the right time.
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It certainly is. CT's madras was not only the worst madras I've ever made it also ranked close to the worst curry I've ever made. If I ever find some MDH kashmiri powder I intend to make it again to see if this brand really does make all the difference.
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SS did you manage to find MDH Kashiri Mirch???.
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SS did you manage to find MDH Kashiri Mirch???.
I did indeed london. And I had another go at CT's madras with it and some proper lemon dressing rather than the lemon juice I used previously.
It was a lot more palatable than my first effort but still had the nasty bitter undertone that I've never had with any other curry before, although I could tolerate the lemon sourness this time as the dressing is far less acidic than real lemon juice. So it wasn't the worst curry I've ever had this time but still not anything like any madras I've ever sampled before (and I've had a few over the years).
Fair enough if it's a regional difference but the kashmiri chilli is definitely not to my liking at all. I still think that a tablespoon of kashmiri as the only chilli in the madras is just wrong, it doesn't have the chilli heat required in a madras for one thing. I can imagine it might work in lower quantities in addition to other chilli powders but I've yet to try that.
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I personally thought Chewys Madras was alright but have now been tweeking a few different recipes and found my personal fave which for me is spot on and has great results every week when I make it :)
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Hi SS have you tried Madrasandy's, that has three types of chilli powder, standard hot chilli powder, Kashmiri chilli powder and Deggi mirch chilli powder. That along with the addition of methi, star anise etc etc makes it a very very good madras!!
Ed
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Chewy's madras is good, but it's nothing like the madras I love and buy
I know he doesn't believe you add old oil to the curry gravy
Well that's what they do around here, and it makes a huge difference to the gravy and subsequent curries.
If I could make an exact BIR madras, I think I would die a happy man
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Madras isn't my favourite curry by any means, but Andy's (madrasandy) latest effort gets my vote :)
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Well that's what they do around here, and it makes a huge difference to the gravy and subsequent curries.
I have no doubt that some definitely add used oil to their bases haldi, when I try it though it seems to make little difference. I've used onion bhaji oil, poppadom oil etc., but any flavour seems to get lost in the overall base flavour so makes no perceptible difference.
I thought it interesting that you got what you consider the BIR smell when using kebab shop oil. Do you know what they cook in the oil and do they sell curries as well?
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I thought it interesting that you got what you consider the BIR smell when using kebab shop oil. Do you know what they cook in the oil and do they sell curries as well?
very late getting back on this, sorry
They cook chips and fried chicken in the oil and it was well used
And no, they didn't make curries
I used this oil to duplicate a curry house that uses the same method
They are now closed but made curries with a very old style flavour
The 1970's taste
The curry mix they used was this Bassar curry powder
This stuff:-
http://www.spicesofindia.co.uk/acatalog/Al-Noor-Pakastani-Bassar-Curry-Masala.html (http://www.spicesofindia.co.uk/acatalog/Al-Noor-Pakastani-Bassar-Curry-Masala.html)
And in my opinion made the best curry in Nottingham
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The curry mix they used was this Bassar curry powder
This stuff:-
http://www.spicesofindia.co.uk/acatalog/Al-Noor-Pakastani-Bassar-Curry-Masala.html (http://www.spicesofindia.co.uk/acatalog/Al-Noor-Pakastani-Bassar-Curry-Masala.html)
And in my opinion made the best curry in Nottingham
Great stuff, Al Noor Bassar Curry Masala; used in place of ground chillies, it adds a whole new level of depth and complexity to the final dish. Interestingly the two Pakistani chaps in our Tibet/Nepal group had not used it; they said that the Al Noor brand is very popular in Pakistan, but they (and their mums) preferred to make their own curry masala by blending and grinding whole spices rather than use any pre-prepared version.
** Phil.
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Great stuff, Al Noor Bassar Curry Masala;
Yes this is what I consider 'authentic' bassar masala because it's got the mustard oil mixed in already. I don't know why but when I try other brands that don't have the oil in and it separately myself it just doesn't produce the same taste - weird.
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it's got the mustard oil mixed in already.
Well spotted but how do they do that? I can see how a chilli can be dried and turned into powder but how can oil be in a dry mix, without the product appearing more like a paste? Perhaps it's just mustard seeds which include nominal oil.
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it's got the mustard oil mixed in already.
Well spotted but how do they do that? I can see how a chilli can be dried and turned into powder but how can oil be in a dry mix, without the product appearing more like a paste? Perhaps it's just mustard seeds which include nominal oil.
It's not a true dry mix George as the oil is just added in. It has a sort of damp texture to it.
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Hi for me we always tend to over complicate a Real BIR Madras sauce, but when it comes from a TA it is light on spice and subtle of flavours and deep on heat.
IMO 60% of a madras is in the base sauce and if this is over spiced then it's never going to happen.
Also the initial frying of the spice is Imo the main culprit for people turning a curry bitter, along with the gravy being way to thick to reduce itself properly.
I am able replicate my TA Madras no problem with 1 spoon oil, half a teaspoon of mix powder and half a teaspoon of ground fenugreek leaf + 1 teaspoon Kashmiri chilli pow + pinch of salt + half teaspoon of tom pur?e, little tamarind and a slice of lemon.
That's all it takes along with a very lightly spiced base gravy and the correct cooking and reducing. :)
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Also the initial frying of the spice is Imo the main culprit for people turning a curry bitter
Hi littlechillie
I dont understand this comment.
Is the bitterness due to undercooking or overcooking?
When I overcook spices, I find that all the flavour has disappeared and the curry is somewhat bland but not really bitter - unless I really burn them. I can imagine a bitter taste then. Perhaps you could explain. Please dont think Im being argumentative...
Maybe Im a bit thick and have missed something
Regards
Mick
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Hi Mick don't worry it's fine with me :)
Please take your base gravy of choice and cook yourself 15 - 20 small portions of curry sauce, use normal style oil, g+g, tom pure, then add your spice and just a little gravy to reduce then taste.
Do this many times in many different ways like spice straight to oil or spice added after tom pur?e, whatever! Cook spice for different lengths of time in the oil so on and so on.
You will be very surprised I'm sure at the different levels of sweet and bitter that getting this part of BIR cooking wrong can cause :)
But if you not often get it wrong now then you prob would not understand my comment as I always used to get inconsistencies In my curry at the start of my road, this was the first thing my local TA advised me to do when I talked to them about inconsistencies in flavour with using the same base gravy.
Hope this explains my post.
Regards.
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It's no more than a medium curry with a few shakes of Lea & Perrins and lemon juice at the right time.
I just did my first Madras today. Pretty good all in all, but I haven't had many BIR Madras, so a bit difficult to say if it replicated. But I did add lemon and worcestershire sauce. I think I forgot about the timing of the additions and just added both very late on in the initial fry. Was I wrong with this, what is "the right time"? Thanks.
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Was I wrong with this, what is "the right time"? Thanks.
Read LC's comments above. Madras is the "simplest" of curries in terms of ingredients (although these themselves are often controversial). However, the computations of what to add, when, in what order and how to cook them are many :o. As for the perfect result, only you can know what you are looking for versus your experience, which will probably differ from mine and everybody else. Doubt if this helps but welcome to the subjective world of BIR cooking ::) A good middle of the road dish will normally satisy any heathen who loves a curry but would never attempt to cook one ;D
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Thanks CH. Yes I ask such questions more to know what the general consensus is, so as to have that as the basis on which my continued attempts will be compared. I don't think for a moment that what any one person says here will be my holy grail, as in any case, there is healthy arguments about almost everything here.
My 1 1/2 year BIR journey has so far taught me that the base sauce offers most influence, and that less is best; I don't think I've under spiced a curry yet. So I did keep my Madras simple. No fenugreek, no garam masala, no fresh coriander. Clearly then the base sauce and the chosen spice mix played a big role, but the lemon did give it an edge.
Staying on subject of the OP, I've never really taken to either Madras or Korma, but I have tried them in the BIR from time to time. And yes, my first ever attempt at Korma struck me as being exactly like the ones from the restaurant, but I should say that also the Madras was pretty OK. I think the cream in the Korma reduces the influence of the base sauce and means that almost any attempt comes out similar, while the Madras is very low on additions, so the base sauce and spice mix are big players in determining the flavour, so more difficult to replicate, if that's what you are looking for.