Curry Recipes Online
Beginners Guide => Hints, Tips, Methods and so on.. => Cooking Methods => Topic started by: noble ox on September 05, 2014, 02:32 PM
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Hi All ;D
This post should help those who are a bit lost as to the basic technique used in many Birs
When learned it will produce a good curry using a good base and spices
Notes on technique: Baghar and Bhunao
Baghar, Tadka or Chonk (instant flavoring or Tempering)
This is one technique that is fairly unique to Indian cooking, whole spices are dropped into oil to infuse. this technique is called Baghar, Tadka or Chonk.
1. Heat oil quite hot but not so hot that it starts to smoke and then drop in whole spices which then release their flavors into the oil.
2. Larger harder spices like stick cinnamon, and star anise can be added first. (stir constantly)
3. Once the larger spices have started to swell and and change color. (stir constantly)
4. cardamom can be added, and shortly thereafter (stir constantly)
5. Smaller spices like fennel seed, cumin or coriander seed can be added last and will only cook for 30 seconds depending on the heat of the oil. (stir constantly)
6. Stir constantly until the smallest spices are fragrant and have darkened in color.
7. Remove from heat.
The purpose of this technique is twofold, to infuse the oil with as much of the flavor from the spices as possible, and to toast and brown the spices themselves which will further develop new flavors in the spices which will infuse the oil.
When baghar (translated as instant flavorings or tempering) is performed correctly there is a physical change in the spices, they will become toasted and more brown, dry spices will uncurl and expand slightly, and the smell will change from a raw spice flavor to a more intense toasted flavor.
Remember to heat your oil before adding your spices, add from the most hardy to the smallest spices, wait for the color change and smell change before moving on in the recipe.
This technique can be used in two different ways, either use the oil in the pan to cook other ingredients or to pour the oil over a completed dish to add another kick of flavor at the end.
Bhunao (sautee)
This is not a French sautee, although it is similar up to a point. Almost all curries and thick sauce dishes use this method of cooking at one point or another. To develop a great Indian sauce this technique is paramount!
1. Oil or ghee is heated in a frying pan (sometimes Baghar(see above) is performed to flavor the oil first). Then wet ingredients are added, it could be vegetables or marinated meat.
2. These ingredients are then cooked over a hot flame to reduce to a thick paste. stir occasionally to keep the ingredients mixed and heating evenly.
3. Once its lost almost all of it's liquid, you can reduce the heat to medium or medium high. Stirring every so often and allowing the paste to lightly stick to the bottom of the pan, then scraping it off with a spatula.
4. Once it begins to stick so much that you can't lightly scrape it off you drop a few tablespoons of liquid ( This is where the base is used) into the pot until the stuck parts will dissolve while you mix and scrape them (deglazing the stuck on foods)
5. This is then mixed into the rest of the paste and you then let the excess liquid evaporate.
6. Repeat the sticking and deglazing 3-4 times.
The real key is to let it stick a little bit and actually brown, just like you let meat brown to get that delicious brown outer crust. The more times you repeat this process and the deeper the browning the more deep and flavorful your paste will become. Just don't let it burn!
This can be done with any liquid that is being added to be pot such as tomato puree, broth or water.
For the record
The browning and maturing of the spices in the Baghar process as well as the browning of the vegetables and marinades are both a result of a Maillard reaction, named after the chemist Louis-Camille Maillard. This process is a very complicated synthesis of organic flavor compounds created by the reaction of sugars with amino acids. They form a vast array of flavor compounds that as of yet haven't been adequately studied. However, they taste... awesome.
This method should help to understand the uses of a base
All free as well ;)
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All free aswell
Very generous ;), just how a forum should be, sharing info for free
Thankyou mr Ox
Great post though, a lot of time and effort gone in to writing that one. :)
Should be useful to a few people especially the newer members
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Thank you Mr Ox, that is a very well explained and well written information. The use of these methods will make such a difference to the overall taste and smell of a curry!
Finding the right combinations for the right curry is important here, and not throwing everything in to one pan as you explained.
Many thanks.
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Hi Mr Ox, is this taken from your own blog?
If so, are you the jolly green giant? :D
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Hi All ;D
This post should help those who are a bit lost as to the basic technique used in many Birs
All free as well ;)
Well copied OX, I thought this text must have come from some of your elusive 400 BIR Ebooks
But no, a straight copy and paste lift, from a bloggers page - here.
http://whiteycooksindian.blogspot.co.uk/2013/03/notes-on-technique-baghar-and-bhunao.html (http://whiteycooksindian.blogspot.co.uk/2013/03/notes-on-technique-baghar-and-bhunao.html)
If your going to pretend to know the art and share, at least you could try and re-write it first. ::)
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Haha you missed the next paragraph-
Notes for food nerds
;)
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There's the comment on the bottom from Goncalo who used to frequent here then went over to the schoolhouse then disappeared.
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And what a loss Goncalo is...... ;)
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And what a loss Goncalo is...... ;)
Ah yes, I remember your constructive criticism. ;)
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I never claimed it was my own work :o I altered some words so as not to annoy the writer
It is a good lesson and works to improve our currys etc
So good it should be here for all to use
Some members like to keep things for there own reasons.Its been on the web for some time now its here
So please no more tug-nut throwing chimps :)
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Well said NO.
But perhaps you should have made it clear that it wasn't your own work in order to not give those who think they are superior the opportunity to criticise :)
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Well said NO.
But perhaps you should have made it clear that it wasn't your own work in order to not give those who think they are superior the opportunity to criticise :)
Didnt know CA was still on here ;)
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Well said NO.
But perhaps you should have made it clear that it wasn't your own work in order to not give those who think they are superior the opportunity to criticise :)
If those who criticise understood the psychology of" why" they must criticise perhaps they would not criticise at every chance .It really is quite infantile
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Has anyone got examples of where they use these 2 methods successfully.
I know the tarka for adding garlic taste. I guess the Bhuna i use for bunjarra. Some base (KD1 being earliest example) use it. I've also for balti tried frying crushed seed.
After that is there anything else. You don't really see much of this going on in a BIR
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Has anyone got examples of where they use these 2 methods successfully.
I know the tarka for adding garlic taste. I guess the Bhuna i use for bunjarra. Some base (KD1 being earliest example) use it. I've also for balti tried frying crushed seed.
After that is there anything else. You don't really see much of this going on in a BIR
Agreed Jerrym, the bhuna technique especially.
seems to have crossed from traditional to bir in name only. Tempering is another that I see on in the 'specials'
Regards
Elw
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jermy
After that is there anything else. You don't really see much of this going on in a BIR
When spices chilli mix powder are added they are cooked scraped then base added this method is used in
Birs The Fleet gang spotted it the war cry was "singe singe"the same as posted method
Its a simplified way of explaining what was happening
It goes on but quickly you could try watching in slow motion ;D
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jermy
After that is there anything else. You don't really see much of this going on in a BIR
When spices chilli mix powder are added they are cooked scraped then base added this method is used in
Birs The Fleet gang spotted it the war cry was "singe singe"the same as posted method
Its a simplified way of explaining what was happening
It goes on but quickly you could try watching in slow motion ;D
It doesnt go on at all in some places, the spices are sometimes cooked in the base.
The spices were all cooked the same way in the zaal/fleet visit, regardless of vindaloo/ Madras/ bhuna / roshney.
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Well said NO.
But perhaps you should have made it clear that it wasn't your own work in order to not give those who think they are superior the opportunity to criticise :)
Right!
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@ELW
It doesnt go on at all in some places, the spices are sometimes cooked in the base.
The spices were all cooked the same way in the zaal/fleet visit, regardless of vindaloo/ Madras/ bhuna / roshney.
The Zaal use mix powder when making a curry spices ground are in the mix powder the post explains the cooking of them.
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My post was aimed at learning something new. I was not wanting to go back to school though.
The only part that caught my eye was the frying of whole spice.
This is something I've briefly tried but feel it's an area I've not exhausted.
Clearly no one else has either. Knowing the theory is all good and well. It's putting it into practice - hence the need for examples.
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@ELW
It doesnt go on at all in some places, the spices are sometimes cooked in the base.
The spices were all cooked the same way in the zaal/fleet visit, regardless of vindaloo/ Madras/ bhuna / roshney.
The Zaal use mix powder when making a curry spices ground are in the mix powder the post explains the cooking of them.
Some places don't use powdered spice at all except in the base, but still turn out a bhuna. How does that work?
There was no difference in spice frying technique(zaal) in any of the dishes. It was only noted that the spice mix could be cooked longer than they thought possible.
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GerryM
Said
My post was aimed at learning something new. I was not wanting to go back to school though.
Its a bit hard for some to remember on this forum that are all levels of curry cooks,
The post was to help all not just the "top of the class gang" who appear to be more skilled at blindly picking holes in threads for ego massaging :D
ELW
said
Some places don't use powdered spice at all except in the base, but still turn out a bhuna. How does that work?
The base is not the END product its the cooking of the curry and the mix powders that are added in MOST birs You need to see not watch some of the videos for many examples
Some chefs add spices because they know them by heart mix powders are used so that not so skilled staff members can help out :D
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Thanks Noble Ox for posting the information.
The author of the material is not really of interest to me. After reading the info I have decided that most of it is not in my humble opinion relevant to my own personal curry quest, but feel sure it might be to some people somewhere.
Thanks again
Best Regards
Mick
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Thanks for the pos response Mickdabass
If it helps 1 person that is what a forum is for
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GerryM
Said
My post was aimed at learning something new. I was not wanting to go back to school though.
Its a bit hard for some to remember on this forum that are all levels of curry cooks,
The post was to help all not just the "top of the class gang" who appear to be more skilled at blindly picking holes in threads for ego massaging :D
ELW
said
Some places don't use powdered spice at all except in the base, but still turn out a bhuna. How does that work?
The base is not the END product its the cooking of the curry and the mix powders that are added in MOST birs You need to see not watch some of the videos for many examples
Some chefs add spices because they know them by heart mix powders are used so that not so skilled staff members can help out :D
It's a forum after all noble ox, if there's holes then they'll be picked. It's better than cheerleading, backslapping worse still adult jealousy
There's alternative methods of achieving bir@home, unfortunately there's not much of it on this forum. No powders are used at all when cooking the finished dishes in one of my locals.
Only powdered turmeric & whole spices blended in the gravy. The gravy is tailored by the chef/cook to be versatile.
The dishes all taste different, with a very slight aniseed flavour in the background. The guy knows what he's doing.
Regards
ELW
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No powders are used at all when cooking the finished dishes in one of my locals.
Only powdered turmeric & whole spices blended in the gravy.
Can you elaborate on that a tad ELW as I'm having difficulty understanding how a BIR curry can be made with no added powders...by which I assume you mean chilli, methi, mix, etc?
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Yes ELW could you elaborate on the no powder added to the final dish, Im very interested in this, I sometimes use blended chilli's instead of powder but after that Im struggling to see how it can be done
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The only powders I use in the base are turmeric & sometimes gm. Whole cumin/coriander in the base. Blended green chilli paste in the base, a very small amount. Kashmiri chilli powder although nice adds a flavour i've never tasted in a curry here, so that's out. If I never had any fresh chilli, i'd use powder but it takes minutes to make
Didn't really think of methi as a powder. But yes dried methi leaves in the finished dish not in the base.
No mix powders flash fried in the pan
If i've got some made, i'll add Ashoka banjara paste to the finished dish, which has a touch of gm cooked slowly in the paste. If the gravy is under or overcooked the banjara paste will be lost as will a mix powder alternative.
Think one of my locals uses whole spice /water stock to flavour their gravy, as with zaal/kushi stuff
Regards
Of note to showing its not a regional thing there's a video somewhere of jb doing a mix powder free pathia
at a place called zaman in datchet I think
It all gets there in the end,. Cooking of the onions & veg properly makes it bir, that's the bit you cant really learn quickly,without making mistakes
Regards
ELW
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I think you are right as my curries seem to be ruined by an over powering flavour coming from the veg and onions rather than the lack of a particular ingredient. What am I not doing right? I have cooked the veg and onions for various different lengths and have used pressure cookers etc but the taste doesn't seem to change.
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noble ox,
my english is not that brill and all should always ask me to clarify what i mean if its not clear.
my issue with the post was that it could send members on the wrong track.
the details on tarka etc at the start of the post originate from Traditional cooking.
they are all used in BIR. the importance though is in applying those basic statements in the BIR. this application is not well visible but crucial in mastering the BIR.
in short the most important "half" of the information is left out.
i would have liked to explore the application and was the aim of my post.
in short the topic is great as Traditional Cooking Method.
in the end the post has got all mixed up. just one of those things
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Some BIR are using the ' all in the base ' method which is basically a completed curry sauce and only chili and the odd whole spice used in the final curry, my local t/a use this method.
1 ladle of base into heated pan , no additional oil to start the curry.
Cook the ladle of base down frying out all the water.
Add another ladle of base on medium heat , add chili powder , star anise , black cardamom .
Add meat and more base turn up heat simmer for approx 2 mins .
Add a good sprinkle of fresh coriander .
Done .
I did ask about the not using of powdered spices in the finished curry and the chef said " everything in the gravy " ???
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@emin-j how do they successfully differentiate their dishes sufficient to create a full menu of different offerings?
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Some BIR are using the ' all in the base ' method which is basically a completed curry sauce and only chili and the odd whole spice used in the final curry, my local t/a use this method.
1 ladle of base into heated pan , no additional oil to start the curry.
Cook the ladle of base down frying out all the water.
Add another ladle of base on medium heat , add chili powder , star anise , black cardamom .
Add meat and more base turn up heat simmer for approx 2 mins .
Add a good sprinkle of fresh coriander .
Done .
I did ask about the not using of powdered spices in the finished curry and the chef said " everything in the gravy " ???
There's no question about this at all emin-j, one of my locals does it. If you discount methi as a powder I don't use them in the final dish either.
I'd use chilli powder is a dish if I had no fresh puree, but that's about it.
I've heard of no garlic/ginger in a base, only at dish stage
Differing amounts of Garlic or G&G, tomato pure,e gravy, ingredients & cooking methods will make the dishes completely different.
ELW
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Some BIR are using the ' all in the base ' method which is basically a completed curry sauce and only chili and the odd whole spice used in the final curry, my local t/a use this method.
No wonder qualities are on a down hill slide,less skills =less wages to pay out
What will happen when the good chefs expire ?
Will the day arrive when tankers deliver bulk curry to Birs ;D
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No wonder qualities are on a down hill slide,less skills =less wages to pay out
What will happen when the good chefs expire ?
Will the day arrive when tankers deliver bulk curry to Birs ;D
Someone probably made that same statement when they saw onion base gravy used in every curry produced......a very along time ago now ::)
I think my local has something like a 60ltr tanker/stock pot
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I think you are right as my curries seem to be ruined by an over powering flavour coming from the veg and onions rather than the lack of a particular ingredient. What am I not doing right? I have cooked the veg and onions for various different lengths and have used pressure cookers etc but the taste doesn't seem to change.
Its probably the reason people have no trouble making kormas, tikka masalas, chasni's, as those creamy ingredients added normally overpower the gravy, which makes the dish what it is.
The more savoury dish ingredients less so. The flavour of the gravy here is crucial.
I've just made a batch of jb's gravy, which tastes very good. I've not cooked with it yet, but i'm certain it'll produce some excellent dishes.
Its not that far away from a finished curry sauce. A touch of GG, methi/tomato puree/salt if necessary & you'll have a good basic curry sauce. I'll try cooking a couple of dishes with no mix powder added & see how that ends up
I gave it about 1 hr hard boil, then it started to catch on the bottom, some I turned the heat down for about another 1 hr 20 so I didn't have to hang over it.
I couldn't do a usual smell test as I had added turmeric early on, but the spicing levels are good & its hard to botch this gravy.
I'd recommend you try this gravy next madstwatter
Regards
ELW
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@emin-j how do they successfully differentiate their dishes sufficient to create a full menu of different offerings?
I've seen pouring cream from a carton going into the frying pan probably a korma or ctm mixed with the ' all in one ' gravy but I guess any curry on the menu which comes in a gravy would be the same base, to be fair me and the mrs have madras plus my daughter has a biryani and the curry is not bad at all.
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Differing amounts of Garlic or G&G, tomato pure,e gravy, ingredients & cooking methods will make the dishes completely different.
Sorry for my poor memory ELW but I'm assuming from this method that you are a Scot?
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Differing amounts of Garlic or G&G, tomato pure,e gravy, ingredients & cooking methods will make the dishes completely different.
Sorry for my poor memory ELW but I'm assuming from this method that you are a Scot?
Yes I am. I'll pre empt you & add, that there's no such thing as a Scottish/Glasgow bir method though. That needs nipped in the bud on this forum.
Edit- with the amount of ta's & restaurants doing this, there's only a small sample of methods available to read and watch. Most are very similar.
Regards
ELW
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madstwatter, re your question. Follow chewytikka 3 hr base video. That is the gold standard so that you know what a base should taste like (after blending after thinning). Then try out other bases till you find some that hit the bell. Throw the pressure cooker out for curry - it's just a complication you don't need.
Ps post is finally interesting.
"Base" for a while now has been tearing me apart. I know how to make what I call a decent base (say mouchak, saffron there are loads. This is essentially along the lines of what I would call an almost finished curry. I use very little mix (0.5 tsp) to convert. I also keep in mind what I know as BIR which has very little spice and relies on the individual ingredients to add variety. I find it works really well and see no need for improvement.
I then came across the local restaurant base which is so basic you would not believe unless tasted. They then rely on what must be complex paste/sauces/2nd bases to produce each dish.
What it all shows is there is much variation across BIR land.
Its no wonder we struggle to make progress.
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Would appreciate info on what dishes the methods are used.
I know from the Nottingham mogal e azam that garlic Tarka is used in the jalfrezi as it's placed in a serving korahi.
I also know from h4ppy-Chris rogan josh that bay and cinnamon are added into the oil.
I remember chewytikka showing a Tarka but did note it at the time.
Any other dishes or ingredient appreciated.
I have tried whole spice briefly in past but not been thrilled feeling further away from BIR.
I'd like to revisit though.
One specific area was trying whole cumin in balti. I found added to oil whole was too bitty. Brief grinding seemed to loose the effect. I presume BIR don't pre treat whole spice.
I feel its an area i just don't know enough about.