Curry Recipes Online
Curry Chat => Lets Talk Curry => Topic started by: JerryM on November 21, 2014, 09:56 PM
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Chillies - is there definitive use guide
A few recent posts have got me thinking I've still not done enough on chillies.
Yes I feel I know all that is available and would get high marks on a blindfold taste test.
Question is am I using the right chilli for the dish and at the right time in the dish fry.
This is my current thinking
1) green finger chilli
? base
? vindaloo (as part of sauce)
? as paste per Ashoka (add early or late if bought bottle)
2) green bullet chilli
? top dressing at end (sliced)
? madras added early
3) red fresh Kashmiri (finger??)
? vindaloo added early (per curry2go)
4) scotch bonnet
? convert to Tom sauce (use like mr nagga jar)
? produce lip burn in hot dishes
5) dried crushed extra hot red chillies
? add any dish increase heat in place of powder (medium hot)
? used in adil balti
6) dried whole red chillies (birds eye)
? can't really decide on these. Very nice flavour stinking hot but less than scotch bonnet. Used only in non curry.
7) dried whole kashmiri
Still to purchase
Any additions/corrections appreciated
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Kashmiri chillies are a minefield Jerry, are they real, are they just grown in Kashmir region, Im onto it with a few pro chilli growing friends, I'll let you know the outcome.
Some of the superhots give amazing lip burn, 2 of the best curries I have ever made have used the jigsaw x tmsb chilli, lovely long slow burn, instant lip heat
Green finger and bullet chillies are pretty much the same in heat wise, but for madras and vindaloo I think fresh green chilli paste works really well combined with Kashmiri chilli powder, the Heera brand of kashmiri adds so much more freshness, colour , flavour and moreishness
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Your posts are always so thoughtful Jerry and I'm not sure if I can contribute much here. I suppose my use of chillies is more limited than what you describe. I don't use scotch bonnets, birds eyes or nagas at all and I don't think I've used dried chillies for at least ten years.
The green finger chilli is what I would use in chilli paste but alternatively the green "bullet" chilli would for me be a substitute. I like to use jalapenos when I make pickled chillies which I then use in quesadillas, or sprinkle on top of tacos. I love to make sweet chilli sauce with largish red chillies that are quite mild (I don't know what type of chillies they are though). My impression is that BIR applications of chillies are somewhat sparing and I wonder if you are using them in a more sophisticated way?
It sometimes feels to me that the complexity and permutations of a lot of ingredients, i.e. herbs, spices, chillies etc. have been reduced to a common denominator by all but the most creative and quality establishments.
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Got my first ever jar of Mr Naga last week - never found it before. Love it .... very lazy compared to fresh chillies, but certainly does the job!
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Stephen,
On the nail - Sophisticated way
I think I'm trying to answer this in 2 ways.
1) What does the STD BIR do
Ie simple not sophisticated: say
Finger chilli in base
Bullet chilli in dish/sauce
Scotch bonnet/naga hot sauce
2) what does the best BIR do
This is where I'm searching for ideas. Ie what I can learn from traditional as I'm convinced the best BIR chef must have come this route.
The dried Kashmiri being an example.
I'm also really aiming for what I call a red and a green chilli sauce for adding into medium and hot dishes respectively.
Bottom line madras and vindaloo.
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For what it's worth Jeryy, my two penneth from what i've seen and done myself
Finger chillis used predominantly in this neck of the woods rather than bullet chillis.
Finely chopped and added midway or a the end of cooking to provide nothing more than additional heat. If added earlier the heat is lessened but the TASTE of chilli comes through in the final dish. Possibly these may add a little chilli flavour but minimal heat
Also used whole towards end of dish cooking to provide colour in the dish as well as optional heat should one choose to eat them with the dish.
Kashmiri - no experience of using them, as it seems difficult to determine whether the chilli is infact Kashmiri or a larger dried red chilli. So one for me to try and report back on.
Dried red. Have had these used in phall dishes and refered to by staff as black chillis - dried red chillis simply fried. Adds a lovely heat to the oil and therefore dish and a lovely nutty unique flavour to the curry itself, as well as a considerable amount of heat.
Love using a dozen of these to bagghar the oil when i'm doing the simple dhall recicpe on site. Gives it a splendid growing background heat which really makes the dish for me.
Crushed / roughly ground dried red chillis. Like to add these to really heat up a dish and give it some bird seed texture as Bengali bob would say. This was used regulary along with fresh green chillis in my phall. I posted a thread on the Padma phall which explains the recipe
As for Mr Naga, and possibly ones own superhot chilli pickle (Viceroy Abbots Langley "naga" sauce) and addition to increase heat and add a little bit of a different flavour to a dish.
Finally, the extra hots. Never had a dish served in a restaurant using these recently. This would probablly be the sort of thing used in show pieces like "the widower curry" and all the other "man versus curry" dishes that seem to exist nowadays. Not even sure what chillis they used when i did my "curryhell" challenge at the Rupali in Newcastle all those years ago.
What i do know though, is that for us chilli heads, dishes can have increasing desirable heat levels by that addition of super hots as well as them giving the dish a unique "fruity" flavour. I like to make a naga phall. Ten naga chillis finely chopped. Half added at the tarka stage of the fry and the other half added to the end dish stage. This seems IMO to provide a good heat as well as a good flavour addition to the curry, without the need for chilli powder ;D
As for bullet chillis which seem to abound in some areas, i've only just started to see them in local supermarkets, never in asian grocers down here. To me they are milder than finger chillis and will add a little heat depending at what stage of the cooking process they are added. They also seem to provide a nice bit of colour in the dish itself, full of heat promise, but sadly lacking :(
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Curryhell,
Fantastic response - appreciated.
Feel you've rapped it up for me.
I think going fwd the thing for me to try (new) is the black chilli ie the dry red cooked in oil at start of dish. This I've not come across. The origin of what's in the bag matters not only the taste.
Best wishes. Puts my mind at rest.
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Jerry, for those that like a little heat these are lovely. Dried red chillis fried in oil till their colour changes a few shades. Fish them out as they will continue to cook on their own for a few seconds. Try them on their own. Great texture, superb flavour followed up by that explosion of heat. Fantastic as an accompaniment, or blend them with oil and add as a condiment when you want instant heat to a dish with an additional "different" layer of flavour. So versatile. I did include this , "my secret ingredient" in my NIS recipe I believe ;D
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Curryhell,
Many thanks for clarification. Had not grasped the idea. Blending hits the spot. Many thanks
Nis recipe - not come across is there link
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finally got round to buying the Kashmiri dry chilli (to try out chrisnw website recipes)
(http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/pics/d919fffa390051a9704658fbf41a5ae0.jpg) (http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/#d919fffa390051a9704658fbf41a5ae0.jpg)
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have got bogged down on these whole red chilli.
there is a video on youtube explaining the rehydration. simple stuff really needs no instruction. however it states there can be bitterness. lost the link and would appreciate if chrisnw could re point to it. you dont think much of the idea of bitterness during the video but it hits you full on when you make.
nearest youtube ive found (red chilli sauce)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a4Lgl-IsaN8 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a4Lgl-IsaN8)
4 off whole chilli rehydrated in 100 ml then blended and used in 1 off portion madras. also tried removing the water whilst hot and blending in watered puree (seems a tad better but no breakthrough)
(http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/pics/1f42307db87dec250f1aea37cca959fd.jpg) (http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/#1f42307db87dec250f1aea37cca959fd.jpg)
ps forgot to add - these whole long chilli "kashmiri" are very different to the crushed red chilli. they are less hot and have more flavour. feel you need to keep both.
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Does this help, Jerry ?
In Mexican and south-western cuisines, fried chillies are usually roasted and rehydrated before they are used. Unless your recipe outlines a different procedure, you can follow these general instructions: Stem and seed the chillies , then place them in a skillet, on a comal (a smooth, flat griddle typically used in Mexico and Central America), or in a 250 degree oven and dry-roast them for three to four minutes. Shake them once or twice and be careful not to scorch them or else they will taste bitter. The chillies should then be added to water that has been heated to just below the boiling point - if it is boiling, the chillies will lose flavour. Use just enough water to cover the chillies and press them down with a lid. Allow them to sit for 20 minutes or until they are soft. At this point, you should taste the water to see if it is bitter, discarding if it is. The chillies can then be used as directed in the recipe.
** Phil.
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Phil,
Many thanks sir
Very useful the info to avoid scorching as I've also started looking at frying in oil per curryhell black chilli suggestion.
Like the idea of off boil too.
Interesting that the seeds (and stem) are removed. I had started to think this was where the bitterness lies.
I have a few cartons of the whole chillies in water un blended and so far no bitterness detected.
It was in the blended form that I initially picked up the bitterness.
Ps for info sugar does sort the problem but would like find the cause.
Best wishes
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removing the stem and seeds has sorted this for me (many thanks phil and chrisnw for the original prompt). its the flavour that's important and removal of the seeds only affects the heat a little which is not a big deal c/w bitterness otherwise..
tried the scorching a little but dont really have a need for it. eating out at traditional place dish came with a whole scorched chilli on top which confirmed the flavour produced. for info the "scorching" is wrong terminology - the chillies need very little heat to change to the darker "purple" colour.
i'm using the hydrated blended dried red chilli in madras but see it in any "plainish" curry dish. eg have adopted it in south indian garlic feeling it work's well.