Curry Recipes Online
Curry Chat => Lets Talk Curry => Topic started by: Kashmiri Bob on June 08, 2020, 12:17 PM
-
I haven't been to Adil's Birmingham for some time. I miss it. I would say in the past Adil's can/have made the finest authentic balti, period. However, I sometimes think what sways me to make such a claim is the strange and wonderful aroma from their baltis. It sets their dishes apart from all the competition. I and others have described it as "perfume", "floral", etc.
I still don't know what it is exactly, but am revisiting the "attar", where I have long suspected the answer lies. At least two attars we are already familiar with, rose and kewra. Both of these can be used in cooking, but they are not the secret of the Adil's balti. There are many others though, loads of them. A needle in a haystack, but who knows, one day. More thought and a bit of luck.
Rob :)
https://m.economictimes.com/magazines/panache/food-drinks/western-chefs-are-turning-scent-composers-but-indian-cuisine-has-always-recognised-its-importance/articleshow/68335423.cms
-
Many years ago now, when I first tried kewra water, I was surprised that I recognised the smell, which is quite pungent. Then I realised it was the smell of the hot towels they hand you at the end of the meal. Do they still do that ... been so long since I've been to a restaurant I'm out of date?
-
My last visit to a restaurant was about three years ago. We did get a hot towel, in sealed plastic, and an After Eight mint, which was very good. But earlier my vindaloo was served in a white pasta dish. Even worse, the garlic naan arrived pre-cut into triangles like a pizza. Disgraceful.
I've got 30 ml of Royal Mughlai Meetha Attar sitting in my Amazon basket. Sounds like the daddy! If anyone has already tried this please let me know, so I don't waste my money.
Rob :)
-
Better buy it quick, Rob
-
The Royal Mughlai Meetha arrived today, but I wasn't in. Back at work, finally. Arranged Royal Mail re-delivery for Saturday. Very excited. The logic being that whilst it may (not) be the Adil aroma, it could still be very good, or even better. Will need to make some base gravy. Looking forward.
Rob :)
-
Jolly good, Rob
-
Arrrr...............Adils! We haven't been there since before Christmas although it used to be our weekly Saturday night treat to spend a couple of hours there. A couple of days after Christmas we went off to Goa for three months and were caught up in the lockdown and were eventually evacuated by the British Government. Strange days we're living in. In the meantime we make do with my home made contributions but like you, yearn for that 'smell and taste of Adils and chat to Aftab.
-
I've got 30 ml of Royal Mughlai Meetha Attar sitting in my Amazon basket.
Did you ever try this and form a view on it's potential? I'd never heard of it before reading your post here but have now ordered some on amazon - expensive compared to kewra and rose waters. Thank you so much for bringing it to everyone's attention.
-
... have now ordered some on amazon - expensive compared to kewra and rose waters.
You're not kidding!
I wonder though, at the price of
-
I'd love to know if it's the missing aroma from pilau rice that I am still trying to obtain.
The "missing aroma" is not missing from Syed's pilau, Santa
-
I'd love to know if it's the missing aroma from pilau rice that I am still trying to obtain.
The "missing aroma" is not missing from Syed's pilau, Santa
-
Well, I only have to lift the lid off one of the two 650ml T/A containers that I filled with Syed's pulao rice after first making it to get that aroma. Like you, it is not something I have previously been able to achieve, but now it is there, "loud and clear".
** Phil.
-
I haven't been to Adil's Birmingham for some time. I miss it. I would say in the past Adil's can/have made the finest authentic balti, period.
Thank you, also, for recommending Adil's. I am hoping to visit it in October, if the lockdown regulations are not tightened again.
I've only been to the Balti triangle once, if that's where it's located. Two years ago, I used google to find the rough area, walked around a bit, and then enjoyed a balti at Shababs on Ladypool Road. It wasn't bad but maybe Adil's is better.
-
My amazon order for 100ml Meetha Attar arrived today and I'm encouraged by the feint whiff when I opened the packet. It's not leaking, as such but a trace may have got out. Like secret santa with kewra water, I thought the aroma seemed familiar but it could be from around 25 years ago when I enjoyed some meals in India and the Middle East. I must compare it with kewra water. If they are based on the same source elements, maybe the Meetha Attar is somehow superior a bit like you can buy different qualities of vanilla. It's not the aroma of BIR pilau rice but it could be useful in biriani, korma and some other dishes.
-
I must compare it with kewra water. If they are based on the same source elements, maybe the Meetha Attar is somehow superior ...
My brief Googling suggested that the meetha attar is the concentrated screwpine oil from which kewra water is made. Really all it means is that instead of adding a glug of kewra water you would instead add a few drops of the meetha attar.
-
Secret Santa - where did you read that meetha attar is from screwpine oil? I just found a youtube video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vMUm5149QVk
...where several ingredients are listed including kewra, rose, saffron and cardamons. If so, it's more like a blend based on someone's recipe, or perhaps various brands vary, somewhat like garam masala.
-
Meetha itr, literally
-
Secret Santa - where did you read that meetha attar is from screwpine oil? I just found a youtube video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vMUm5149QVk
...where several ingredients are listed including kewra, rose, saffron and cardamons. If so, it's more like a blend based on someone's recipe, or perhaps various brands vary, somewhat like garam masala.
I think you may be right George. I can't find the sources I used when I first Googled but having another look around it seems there's no one answer and it may be that each manufacturer is slightly different. Kewra essence did seem to be a constant though. But what did seem to crop up many times was the rubbishing of most of the brands as being inauthentic. In particular one web site said stay away from Amazon! I am interested to see what you make of your comparison of it to actual kewra water.
-
Secret Santa - I too am keen to compare the expensive 100ml of attar bought on amazon with relatively low cost Kewra water. I need to buy a new bottle of kewra water but when I smelled kewra water before, the aroma was minimal, whereas the aroma from the attar is superb. I think Bob may have been on to something and it was good of him to start this thread. But he hasn't logged in since his last post on 17 June.
-
... when I smelled kewra water before, the aroma was minimal ...
Well that's strange. My bottle of KTC kewra water is well over a year old and yet it is still very pungent. Also, do you get any familiar aroma from the meethi attar or is it entirely new to you?
-
My bottle of Attar arrived eventually, Air India. No mention of Royal on the label. Does indeed smell of Kewra, and I think rose, and other things I can't place. Volatile stuff. The top's on tight and the bottle is in a cupboard. Open cupboard door and the whole kitchen smells of the attar in seconds. Look forward to trying it out in a curry. My next move will be a trip to a little shop I know in Sparkhill, Birmingham. Occurred to me that Attars are the kind of thing the owner may stock. Will be able to top up on some fresh spices too.
Rob :)
-
Does indeed smell of Kewra, and I think rose, and other things I can't place.
The thing is ... does it remind you of any BIR smells? Maybe like biryani of old perhaps, as that's where it would traditionally be used?
-
Does indeed smell of Kewra, and I think rose, and other things I can't place.
The thing is ... does it remind you of any BIR smells? Maybe like biryani of old perhaps, as that's where it would traditionally be used?
I have no experience of old biryani. The only dish I have noticed to incorporate distinct perfumery (albeit delicate) is the Birmingham Balti, especially at the Adil. Think this particular attar won't be what I am looking for, but as we know the cooking process can alter things radically, so will have to see. I will be trying it out in combination with Rajah tandoori powder and rotisserie chicken strips/stock. The attar will probably be going in during base gravy prep. I will call it Balti Chicken Mughlai Royale. Whilst there is no mention of royalty on the bottle, or mughlai, the cost of the stuff warrants some grandeur.
Rob :)
-
I bought a chilled food dish from Aldi yesterday - Chicken Tikka Masala - to try out my Meetha Attar for the first time. Well, I had to start somewhere! The Aldi dish is half decent and it wouldn't have been worth me making my own CTM, for this simple test. I added about 0.25 tsp. The test failed in that it seemed to knock out the pleasant normal flavour of the sauce and not add anything better. Next, I will try adding it to plain boiled rice, without any other flavourings. I hope it doesn't poison me. I think the amazon listing mentioned 'food grade' but there's nothing on the bottle. The aroma of the Meetha Attar is very pleasant on it's own and seems vaguely familiar. Perhaps it was used as a room fragrance in a restaurant somewhere, rather than being tasted in food.
-
I'm sure it won't poison you, George, but a quarter of a teaspoonful seems a great deal to me. That is the sort of quantity I would use when adding kewra water or rose-petal water, and an attar/"itr" is many time stronger than those. I would have thought that, quite literally, "a few drops" would have been closer to the ideal amount.
** Phil.
--------
http://www.attarmist.co.uk/what-is-attar/
https://www.foodieshutrecipes.com/kolkata-style-chicken-biryani/
-
My starting point for the base gravy will be 1 drop per kilo of onions.
-
Knowing it's your particular favourite, you should have tried it in a korma first George as meetha attar is, as far as I can tell, only used in Mughlai dishes. Also, of course, biryani. But I doubt any BIR, except perhaps for top-end restaurants, will ever have used it. Oh, and like others have said, this is a concentrated form of the essence so a drop or two only is needed per dish.
-
My starting point for the base gravy will be 1 drop per kilo of onions.
I don't think it's meant for the base, only finished dishes (biryani, korma etc.).
-
SS - korma (BIR style) was of interest to me until ten years ago but no longer. I just had a hunch that Meetha Attar might give a lift to CTM but I was wrong. The reason I added 1.25ml was that an Indian chef on youtube added 20ml kewra water and 20ml rose water to a biriani. The flavour of Meetha Attar was hard to notice in the CTM so I'm not sure it was too much. I predict that Meetha Attar will be almost impossible to discern if only adding 1 drop per kilo of onions.
-
I think that your Indian chef would be in the minority, George, unless he was cooking a family-sized portion. Most of the Indian authorities on Youtube seem to recommend just a few drops, as in (for example)
Pankaj Kumar Pandey
Answered December 25, 2018
Author has 62 answers and 165.2K answer views
Kewra jal used in final stage of briyani
Final stage of MIXING & SERVING:
This is the most important part of preparing the Chicken Biriyani. You have your rice ready, and you also have your chicken, for this, you need 4/5 threads of Saffron, 1/2 cup of warm milk, KEWRA ESSENCE or ROSE WATER. Kewra Water is an extract distilled from pandanus flowers and used to flavour meats, drinks, and desserts in India and South east Asia. Put the saffron threads in the warm milk and you will get flavoured milk. Now get a pan with deep and flat surface. You can also use pressure cooker as well. Put some ghee inside the pan and also apply the ghee on the inner surface as well. Next put the prepared rice and put two/three pieces of chicken on it. Now spread the saffron flavored milk and few drops of Kewra essence/rose water on it. Again repeat the same process and when you are finished with chicken pieces, cover the upper layer with rest of the prepared rice. Next Put the lid on or close the pressure cooker and heat the pan for another 5-8 minutes.
Next open the lid and you will get the aromatic, flavored Chicken Biriyani. We have used Saffron so that the rice will get nice orange texture.
TIPS: DO NOT USE TOO MUCH KEWRA WATER/ROSE WATER as TOO MUCH FLAVOUR OF IT WILL RUIN THE FLAVOUR and TASTE OF CHICKEN BIRIYANI.
Only 2-3 drops of the Kewra essence or rose water is enough in each layers.
-
Phil - thank you for quoting that web page. I'm probably trying to run before I can walk. I'm now going to keep the expensive Meera Attar sealed until I get a feel for the impact of the related but much lower cost Keera and Rose waters. I like Biryani so will make that my practice vehicle. I wonder how many BIRs use Keera and Rose water in their Biryani.
Here's the youtube video I mentioned. He adds two lots of big squirts of Kewra and Rose waters. I tried to estimate the quantity when I typed up the recipe. It's quite a large quantity of Biryani but a lot more than a few drops: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9XGKjloyL48
-
He gives the amount in the closed captions, George. 10ml, seen at https://youtu.be/9XGKjloyL48?t=175. And that is for 1kg of mutton, or (roughly) enough for 4
-
G@d knows how much he adds in total !
You could perhaps ask him, as a question related to the video. I take the visual information as the most useful indicator in youtube recipes. Text information or verbal descriptions often don't tally. So the text guidance, in your earlier quote, to use a few drops, might actually be a few splashes in practice - vastly more. As you say, who knows? That's why I want to find out for myself. Another example - cooks often say to add a pinch of salt but I see them adding more like 5ml or even 10ml.
-
George
youve derailed this thread. The subject is Balti not Biryani
Regards
Mick
-
I don't think that's entirely fair, Mick
-
youve derailed this thread. The subject is Balti not Biryani
By commenting like that, I suggest you derailed the forum when you joined.
You can hop off as far as I'm concerned.
-
If there is general consensus that the thread should be split into "Balti" and "Attar", I would be more than happy to do that.
I don't think it's necessary but, if you did, we'd end up with only 2 or 3 posts about Balti and something like 3 pages on Attar. A better idea might be to change the thread title to "Attar". The mickdabass comment was wholly inappropriate because this thread was never really about Balti.
-
There is really only one person whose opinion counts here, and that is Bengali Bob, since it is he who started the thread. His introductory post was very specifically about Adil's balti, so changing the thread title would be completely wrong, IMHO.
Rob, would you prefer it to remain as one thread (called "The Elusive Adil's Balti"), or be split into two : "The Elusive Adil's Balti", and "Meetha attar and its uses" ?
** Phil.