Curry Recipes Online
Curry Photos & Videos => Pictures of Your Curries => Topic started by: Peripatetic Phil on June 25, 2020, 05:57 PM
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Both made exactly to spec
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Of those two pictures, which one is representative of the true colour of the curry? Oh, and for goodness sake Phil, spoon some of that oil off before serving it!
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Of those two pictures, which one is representative of the true colour of the curry? Oh, and for goodness sake Phil, spoon some of that oil off before serving it!
Unfortunately the two images were not colour balanced but that is now rectified. I didn't want to spoon off any oil because I wanted to give a 100% faithful depiction of (a) the curry in the pan, and (b) the curry and rice on the plate. That was the oil that was present, and no extra oil (above and beyond that stated in the recipes) was used at any stage. I now have a Kikkoman bottle 2/3 full of spiced oil which I will use to dredge my seekh kebabs when I next make them.
** Phil.
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Gads!!!
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Both made exactly to spec
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I'm not following Syed closely so I don't know the underlying recipe/quantities but in my single serving I typically have 1 Tbsp oil from the base (my base is pretty light on oil) plus some indeterminate amount of oil from the garlic ginger plus either 3 or 4 Tbsp oil to cook the curry (standard portion). I don't know what I do different but I manage to keep the 4+ Tbsps emulsified into the sauce.
You can look at anything labelled restaurant curry picture on glebekitchen. I don't change anything when I take the pictures. No removing oil. No tricks. Always pictures of my dinner (styled of course). Goes from the pan to a bowl for pictures, reheated in the pan, onto a plate with some rice and dal and into my mouth.
I don't understand why anyone would want their emulsification to break like this and spoon the oil off (unless calories were more important than flavour). You aren't just lifting calories. All the flavour from the spice infused oil is lost as well.
How much oil went into that total? That really doesn't look good to me at all. I'd likely send it back as well or at the very least never go to that restaurant again.
Except the rice. It's out of focus but from what I can tell it looks impressive.
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I don't know what you're doing differently Phil. I'm not getting any oil separation out of Syed's base, even after extended cooking. Maybe something to do with your preservation process as mine is in the fridge.
I had oil come out of the Chicken Bhuna/Rogon during the reduction stage, and I did remove some, but I put that down as being my own fault due to not actually measuring the oil into the pan and I know I put in excess ghee.
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If you
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Phil.
Either you are not able to follow a recipe or you dont want to.
I have produced very good currys following Syeds instructions.
Quite how you produced a curry with all that oil then photographing it makes me wonder if its a wind up
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Phil. Either you are not able to follow a recipe or you dont want to. I have produced very good currys following Syeds instructions. Quite how you produced a curry with all that oil then photographing it makes me wonder if its a wind up.
In reverse order : absolutely not a wind-up
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I am reaching the conclusion that the primary factor involved was the re-heating of the base on the hob. The oil, by its very nature, accumulates on the top, and therefore the first few ladles of base removed will contain more oil pro rata than will subsequent ladles. These were the very two first ladles of base removed from the casserole dish, so they contained more oil than subsequent ladles will. The reason that I keep my base on the hob is very simple
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Well whether it was a fair reflection on Syed
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One final thought
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I probably should have said not looked so oily, because unless your base is very oily, there would have been more base in the dish to the amount of oil.
Well, my base is very oily, almost certainly as a result of being stored at room temperature and re-heated twice. It will become less oily over time, as each time that I remove a ladle of base, I remove more oil, and because the last thing that the ladle passes through on its way out of the casserole is the oil layer, it will automatically pick up oil as it emerges from the base. Ultimately there will be little oil left (at which point I shall add more !).
But that apart, no matter how much base I had added, I would have reduced it back to my desired consistency, so as reduction can only increase the oil concentration rather than reduce it, I genuinely cannot see how adding more base might have reduced the visible oil.
Oh and, like I said, you didn't cook it to spec as stated?
I am sure that no-one here is seeking to argue, so if it will clarify matters let me say once and for all that :
- The base was made to spec., but not stored to spec.
- The pre-cooked chicken was made to spec. and stored to spec.
- The final curry was made to spec., modulo the use of only two ladles of base rather than 31/2.
However, what is a ladle ? I have no idea how many ml of base Syed's ladle holds, any more than I know how much mine holds. In his video, I see him adding approximately 31/2 ladles of base. I added 2. That may have been only 0.57 of the required amount, it may have been more, it may have been less. FOAM sufferers would undoubtedly have asked Syed how much his ladle holds. I did not.
** Phil.
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Well whether it was a fair reflection on Syed
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I have to agree that this basic chicken curry is excellent. I've also thoroughly enjoyed the other dishes tried so far. I'm looking forward to another batch of Tikka over the weekend and as I've bought 4 kg of organically farmed breast fillet I'll be doing some pre-cooked for future curry. It will go a long way as my family have rebelled and I'm the only one eating Indian at the moment.
Is that your usual rice Phil? I rated Syed's rice as really good. Easy method with excellent result.
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I have to agree that this basic chicken curry is excellent. I've also thoroughly enjoyed the other dishes tried so far. I'm looking forward to another batch of Tikka over the weekend and as I've bought 4 kg of organically farmed breast fillet I'll be doing some pre-cooked for future curry. It will go a long way as my family have rebelled and I'm the only one eating Indian at the moment.
Yes, I too make a lot of Syed's tikka, which I rate very highly, but I now substitute Laziza tandoori paste for Patak's, and my wife and I agree that the Laziza version is significantly better. For the next batch I will use Laziza tikka botti in conjunction with Syed's recipe and see how that works out.
Is that your usual rice Phil? I rated Syed's rice as really good. Easy method with excellent result.
No, Syed's, using the "excess water" method which I have never rated in the past but which I now agree works very well. A part of the "secret" (if there is such) is to remove the saucepan lid only briefly so as to retain as much of the aromatic vapour as possible. His rice gets even better as it gets older.
P.S. Dessert, on these occasions, is always one of three : Carte d'Or coffee ice-cream (sometimes with Camp coffee drizzled on), home-made Eton mess, or apricot compote. For those who have never made the last, it really cannot be recommended too highly. Fresh apricots, stalk stubs removed, gently poached in pre-reduced syrup (375gm preserving sugar to 1 litre water), transferred to empty Bonne Maman apricot compote jars and stored in the 'fridge. Not only does leaving the stones in contribute an extra layer of flavour, it also means that one eats less, since while with (stoneless) Bonne Maman one can just spoon it down without even pausing, with the stones left in one has to pause after each apricot in order to remove the stone from one's mouth, and in practice I therefore probably eat only half as much compote at any one time.
** Phil.
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This was a perfect curry, probably the best I have ever achieved.
Again, this is so good to hear. Make sure it's well documented in terms of exactly what you did, so you can hopefully repeat it. But is it still not as good as the local BIR madras which you mentioned? Also, if you generally prefer madras type chili heat, can't you try turning it into a madras by adding extra fresh chili and/or chili powder? Maybe that could taste better than Syed's own madras!
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This was a perfect curry, probably the best I have ever achieved.
Again, this is so good to hear. Make sure it's well documented in terms of exactly what you did, so you can hopefully repeat it. But is it still not as good as the local BIR madras which you mentioned?
That is so hard to say. I will have to have another Ganesha Madras delivered, so I can compare them side-by-side.
Also, if you generally prefer madras type chili heat, can't you try turning it into a madras by adding extra fresh chili and/or chili powder? Maybe that could taste better than Syed's own madras!
I will do that in due course, but if I can sustain the hunger pains for a little longer this evening, I hope to try a 31/2-ladle version, just to see if it makes any difference. (The scientist in me keeps repeating "change only one parameter at a time").
** Phil.
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(The scientist in me keeps repeating "change only one parameter at a time").
Amen to that!
As regards the oil on the base why don't you either:
a) spoon it off before using the base (it can of course be reused so no waste) and/or
b) give the base a good stir each time before use to distribute what oil there is uniformly throughout the base?
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I don't understand why anyone would want their emulsification to break like this and spoon the oil off (unless calories were more important than flavour). You aren't just lifting calories. All the flavour from the spice infused oil is lost as well.
There's nothing inherently wrong with adding an excess of oil. Indeed I would argue that an excess is required to achieve a BIR result. I do spoon off all excess when the curry has cooked though (oil separation a must as an indicator of doneness) and use this as my spiced oil rather than creating a batch from fresh. So the spice infused oil is not "lost" it is reused.
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As regards the oil on the base why don't you either:
a) spoon it off before using the base (it can of course be reused so no waste) and/or
b) give the base a good stir each time before use to distribute what oil there is uniformly throughout the base?
The latter may work
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I don't understand why anyone would want their emulsification to break like this and spoon the oil off (unless calories were more important than flavour). You aren't just lifting calories. All the flavour from the spice infused oil is lost as well.
There's nothing inherently wrong with adding an excess of oil. Indeed I would argue that an excess is required to achieve a BIR result. I do spoon off all excess when the curry has cooked though (oil separation a must as an indicator of doneness) and use this as my spiced oil rather than creating a batch from fresh. So the spice infused oil is not "lost" it is reused.
I'm not sure if we are speaking across each other. How much oil is excess oil in your estimation? I typically run 4-6 tablespoons of oil in each portion so is excess 10 tablespoons?
My observation is simply that there are a significant number of oil soluble compounds in spices. If you cook your curry until it breaks and spoon it off then those spice flavour compounds are not in the oil you have spooned off and not in your final dish. Further, the mouthfeel provided from the fat is also removed.
Also, why do you feel that breaking the emulsion is an indication of the dish being done? What characterizes done?
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However, what is a ladle ? I have no idea how many ml of base Syed's ladle holds, any more than I know how much mine holds. In his video, I see him adding approximately 31/2 ladles of base. I added 2. That may have been only 0.57 of the required amount, it may have been more, it may have been less. FOAM sufferers would undoubtedly have asked Syed how much his ladle holds. I did not.
So this evening I decided to see how much my ladles do hold. I have four, but only three were quickly accessible (including the one that I used to make the curry yesterday) so I measured those. 70, 80 and 120 ml respectively. It was the 120 ml that I used yesterday, so that was 240 ml or two cups of base. My observation of Syed's video suggested to me that he used 31/2 ladles, but 31/2 of what size ? If he used a 70ml ladle (my smallest), then 31/2 x 70 = 245 ml
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Well I may be going against the grain, but the oil doesn't bother me - and given you think its one of the best you've made Phil then I think I shall follow suit with this recipe. As others say, you can spoon the oil off but I reckon I'd be soaking it up on my nan bread :)
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He adds a little extra on several occasions after the initial gravy and continually refers to the thin consistency of the 'Curry' as opposed the 'Bhuna'. I think that right at the start he emphasises that his Base Gravy has been thinned down for the dish as well, but I'd need to re-watch it to confirm.
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Please see photographs (below) of tonight's version. Sadly not on a par with yesterday's. As "instructed", I used the full 31/2 ladles of base. It was too much, as I had feared it would be. The spicing was too dilute, the flavour lacking. I ate only five of the seven pieces of chicken, and shall use my own judgement in future as to how much base to add. The basic problem is that if there is almost twice as much base but you want the same level of flavour with the same amount of spice, you have to reduce the volume to the same as was made using two ladles, and then the sauce will be too thick. The alternative, which is the one I chose, is to reduce until the consistency is correct and then put up with the lack of flavour. Ah well, at least I now have a new Chasseur casserole dish at a very reasonable price.
** Phil.
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Looks to me like you need a new dinner plate to go with that Chasseur casserole Phil. Is that a crack running right across it? The father of a surfing mate of mine growing up would have smashed it on sight. Right or wrong he destroyed any cracked crockery after proclaiming it to be a bacteria breeding colony.
Now that I've had a go at your plate, I'll say that I'm not a fan of wet curry either. In my experience excess gravy is wasted and ends up down the sink. I imagine the spice could be adjusted by simply adding extra mixed curry powder if you did like wet curry and wanted the extra. Syed does definately say to double the spice mix if cooking fresh or boiled chicken.
I don't know if it's just lighting, but your basic chicken curry appears to be much darker than mine, and (from memory) Syed's.
I haven't gone back to check on whether he uses watered down gravy yet. If he does that could explain the colour difference but it would also mean even lighter spicing than you're getting. Ok. I'm pretty sure he's referring to the gravy in the finished curry being thinner, and not the base gravy.
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Looks to me like you need a new dinner plate to go with that Chasseur casserole Phil. Is that a crack running right across it? The father of a surfing mate of mine growing up would have smashed it on sight. Right or wrong he destroyed any cracked crockery after proclaiming it to be a bacteria breeding colony.
"Bacteria, schmacteria". Yes, the plate was cracked; it remained that way, getting slowly worse, for about eighteen months, and then the two parts finally parted. I took my trusty two-part Araldite epoxy resin, stuck it together, and it remains perfect to this day (and handles being washed up daily in quite hot water).
I don't know if it's just lighting, but your basic chicken curry appears to be much darker than mine, and (from memory) Syed's.
When I feel more awake I will bring the remains of last night's curry upstairs to check if the on-screen colour rendition is faithful and report back.
[Update : OK, I have both the plate and the pan upstairs now, and whilst the colour rendition is not perfect, it is not so far off as to create a false impression. Do you have any photographs of your basic chicken curry, Livo (and if not, could you take one/some next time ?). I have to say, the sauce has improved immensely simply by being left overnight
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You must really like that dinner plate Phil. I can't say I've ever bothered Aralditing a dinner plate back together and probably never will.
There is a picture of my Basic Chicken Curry over on Josephine from June 22. It is the 3 pieces of chicken right at the top but unfortunately the gravy is under the Turmeric Rice. You can however see, from the colour of the chicken pieces, that it is clearly a much lighter colour than yours. I'll be doing another tomorrow.
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You must really like that dinner plate Phil. I can't say I've ever bothered Aralditing a dinner plate back together and probably never will.
It's one of a pair, in what I think is called "earthstone", which means that I can put them in a hot oven to warm up with no risk of the glaze breaking up. That's why I like them. And I was rather proud of my repair ...
There is a picture of my Basic Chicken Curry over on Josephine from June 22. It is the 3 pieces of chicken right at the top but unfortunately the gravy is under the Turmeric Rice. You can however see, from the colour of the chicken pieces, that it is clearly a much lighter colour than yours. I'll be doing another tomorrow.
I will take a look and report back.
(https://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=13805.0;attach=9311;image) (https://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=15519.0;attach=9349;image)
[Update: 9 o'clock to 11 o'clock ? If so, then I would say it's primarily down to lighting. Remember the 5D has no integrated flash, I eat in the evening, and the room is lit by a single 18W overhead (but off-centre) LED light, so unless I do a lot of faffing around in Photoshop I am unlikely to get good colour rendition. I'll re-photograph in natural light in a few minutes in the kitchen. See above and below.]
** Phil.
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Yep. Ok. Not too different. Your other pics made it appear much darker. All good and we are in the same game.
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OK, finished up the remains of last night's "Syed's basic chicken curry & pilao rice" and it was much much better than yesterday. A great deal of evaporation had taken place, and the consistency was closer to that of a bhuna than a simple curry, but as a result the flavours of the spices were much intensified, and I enjoyed this evening's meal very much. I have in the meantime asked Syed about the capacity of his ladle and am now trying to decide whether to risk another go at his Madras (bearing in mind the lesson learned from the basic curry