Curry Recipes Online
Curry Chat => Lets Talk Curry => Topic started by: jb on September 22, 2010, 11:11 AM
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I'm making another base sauce tonight and am considering adding spiced oil to it to see how it affects the taste.I made a batch of onion bhajis last night(very nice) and have kept the oil.I know it's been debated to death but I am wondering how many members use fresh oil in their base or just stick with plain old veg oil.I must admit my oil doesn't have the best smell in the world and I can't see that it will give me a better taste....The Undercover book swears by it although the chef on my recent lessons was aghast when I mentioned it!!
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Hi Jb,
Somebody on the other forum named sced (Pete) has posted his own recipe for spiced oil based on what information he got talking to some BIR workers who were having a fag break!
It is a recipe to produce both the spiced oil and to create a load of onion/pepper mix at the same time. I won't post the recipe here as I don't have permission from the OP.
I made this 2 nights ago and it does smell very BIR so I'll be making a base using this oil and cooking a curry with it very soon. Pete claims that he has achieved 100% BIR with this recipe so I'm hopeful.
Personally I wouldn't put used bhaji oil in my curries. The constant heating of oil does tend to degrade the oil and it just gets more and more unhealthy the more it is heated up.
Cheers,
Paul
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Do you have a link?
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jb , some weeks ago I made a Base as in the Undercover Curry book and for the Bhaji oil I used the Oil from our deep fryer , whether it was the Oil or the other ingredients I don't normally use in the Base ( Asafoetida or Cabbage ) but the aroma through the House and down the street :o was stunning and I have never had a Base produce such a BIR aroma . Unfortunately I believe the Oil which also had been used to fry Chips as well as Bhaji's gave the Base a horrible underlying flavour but I could have been the Starch from the Chips , If I had recent Oil that only Bhaji's had been cooked in I wouldn't hesitate to use it.
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Wish I had seen the last post earlier,I just finished making my base sauce but I binned the spiced oil;the smell really put me off!!! I was scared of spoiling a good sauce i guess.I did use a bit of asafoetida couldn't really tell me difference in the finish again I was hesitant to use a lot after reading some of the posts about it.Next time I will definitely use the spiced oil thanks guys.I walked past a new local combined Indian takeaway/kebab/chicken place tonight,I have to say the place looks really average but the smell coming from where the Indian place is situated was amazing!!!
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the aroma through the House and down the street :o was stunning and I have never had a Base produce such a BIR aroma . Unfortunately I believe the Oil which also had been used to fry Chips as well as Bhaji's gave the Base a horrible underlying flavour
Are you saying that the same base smelled brilliant but tasted awful?
If so, for the best effect, it might pay to have this base simmering away to fill the area with the best aroma, whilst another base is actually used to prepare the curries.
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the aroma through the House and down the street :o was stunning and I have never had a Base produce such a BIR aroma . Unfortunately I believe the Oil which also had been used to fry Chips as well as Bhaji's gave the Base a horrible underlying flavour
Are you saying that the same base smelled brilliant but tasted awful?
If so, for the best effect, it might pay to have this base simmering away to fill the area with the best aroma, whilst another base is actually used to prepare the curries.
Hi George , yes that would do the trick :) very disappointed with the Curries made with this Base ended up tipping 8 litres down the sink ! Difficult to describe the unwanted flavour a bit sort of acidic I suppose , can only guess it was the Chip tainted Oil.
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hi guys the oil is used twice! once to cook 150 bhajis in and once in the base or final curry so it would be much less harmful than the oil in your chipfryer/ deepfat fryer that you cook your chips and heat many times.
regards
gary
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I use a two handled wok and only cook bhajis, pakoras, onions and peppers in the oil and then use the oil from the wok to cook my curries. If the recipe calls for 2 TBSP of veg oil i only use 1 TBSP of the spiced oil and get very good results, if a dish requires to be oily then i add extra spiced oil to my liking.
I have cooked a curry with oil used from cooking chips in and was quite disgusting very acidic (has somebody mentioned before) so i always keep my oils seperate, have been using the same oil now for about 3 months and the taste gets better and better. I sometimes add half and half ( recipe requires 2 TBSP i then add 1 TBSP of veg oil and 1 TBSP of the spiced oil).
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I use a two handled wok and only cook bhajis, pakoras, onions and peppers in the oil and then use the oil from the wok to cook my curries. If the recipe calls for 2 TBSP of veg oil i only use 1 TBSP of the spiced oil and get very good results, if a dish requires to be oily then i add extra spiced oil to my liking.
I have cooked a curry with oil used from cooking chips in and was quite disgusting very acidic (has somebody mentioned before) so i always keep my oils seperate, have been using the same oil now for about 3 months and the taste gets better and better. I sometimes add half and half ( recipe requires 2 TBSP i then add 1 TBSP of veg oil and 1 TBSP of the spiced oil).
I don't fancy cooking Bhaji's in a Oil filled Wok as if that lot ignited :o
So I am going to purchase a second deep fat fryer which will be kept just for Bhaji's etc.
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Well I made sced's spiced oil recipe and the results were very good. It may be the missing 10% for me at least. It goes in the base and is used to fry the final curry with.
It is easy to make, takes about 1 hour and there is no wastage. The onion/pepper paste it produces as well is also a nice sweet addition to the curries.
CA came close with his spiced oil but it was a mistake to add water.
Cheers,
Paul
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Hi PaulP,
Is there any chance that you could ask sced? for permission to post the recipe or better still, get sced to join this forum.
I wouldn't mind giving it ago.
Or you could PM me the recipe if you wish ::) ;D
Ray :)
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Hi PaulP,
Is there any chance that you could ask sced? for permission to post the recipe or better still, get sced to join this forum.
I wouldn't mind giving it ago.
Or you could PM me the recipe if you wish ::) ;D
Ray :)
Ditto :)
Please?
Regards
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PMs sent.
Cheers,
Paul
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Hi
Just a bit of feed-back on the spiced oil.
Made it with:
6 x tsp - Bruce Edwards spice mix
4 x tsp - Tandoori masala (Rajah)
2 x tsp - Asafoetida (Natco)
The rest was as specified.
While cooking the aroma was very pleasant. Although during the cooking stage there was no eureka moment triggered by the aroma etc. I was beginning to think that this may add a little something but it was unlikely to be ground breaking.
I decided to pick a simple and fairly lightly spiced recipe with which to try the oil initially, so chose a slightly tweaked CA base coupled with the Undercover Curry - Dopiaza, using the onion paste that is produced with this recipe as a by-product of the oil.
The results... Absolutely stunning. I rate my local TA, they make not the best curry I have ever had but some really nice curry all the same. This dopiaza was nicer than any curry I have had from the TA, no question. The aroma and taste was astonishing, TBH I'm still a little in disbelief myself.
The plan tonight is to do a side by side madras test, one with plain oil and one with spice and do a kind of blind taste test. Lets see what happens.
P.S sorry I cannot post the recipe here, I don't have permission to do that - I'm not sure how we can overcome this?
Cheers
Russell
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Hi Russell,
I made this lamb korai thingy last night:
(http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/pics/ab58eedf96d947a4db4ad5eccc2f1b58.JPG) (http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/#ab58eedf96d947a4db4ad5eccc2f1b58.JPG)
Very nice indeed and tastes even better today!
Cheers,
Paul
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Hi Paul
Nice cooker! - wish mine was one of those!
Even nicer looking 'korai thingy' - looks absolutely delicious.
Did you use exclusively spiced oil for it?
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Hey PaulP,
That is one beast of hob you got there! As SP say's, I also wish I had one of those bad boy's.
Great looking dish too, well done.
Ray :)
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Thanks guys, the cooker came with the house. It's a Smeg (!) 6 ring range but it's far from perfect. The oven fan and cooling fan are really noisy.
The curry used spiced oil throughout, both in the base and final cooking. The base was a take on Dipu's with a third of a block of coconut added and using the Taz spice mix.
The dish was also finished using more Taz spice mix.
I'll be adopting the spiced oil as standard now but still have some fine tuning to do.
Cheers,
Paul
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Hi Paul,
It's great to hear that your having some success with the oil, that encourages me to give it a go.
Many Thanks,
Ray :)
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Here's someone else's take on it
http://www.grouprecipes.com/21149/spiced-oil.html (http://www.grouprecipes.com/21149/spiced-oil.html)
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I use a two handled wok and only cook bhajis, pakoras, onions and peppers in the oil and then use the oil from the wok to cook my curries. If the recipe calls for 2 TBSP of veg oil i only use 1 TBSP of the spiced oil and get very good results, if a dish requires to be oily then i add extra spiced oil to my liking.
I have cooked a curry with oil used from cooking chips in and was quite disgusting very acidic (has somebody mentioned before) so i always keep my oils seperate, have been using the same oil now for about 3 months and the taste gets better and better. I sometimes add half and half ( recipe requires 2 TBSP i then add 1 TBSP of veg oil and 1 TBSP of the spiced oil).
I don't fancy cooking Bhaji's in a Oil filled Wok as if that lot ignited :o
So I am going to purchase a second deep fat fryer which will be kept just for Bhaji's etc.
Always use this method to cook my bhajis never had any problems with it catching fire only cook two or three at a time then when the other couple of bhajis are placed in the oil will cool slightly so i have never had problems with the oil being to hot.
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I use only spiced oil, at all stages of the preparation : making the stage-1 and stage-2 sauce, pre-cooking the chicken, and making the final curry. As Kris Dhillon makes plain, a good curry requires an excess of oil which can then be poured off before the final dish is served; I then continually recycle this oil through subsequent base sauces, pre-cooked chicken and further curries, augmenting it with new oil (usually groundnut oil, but grapeseed oil if I have any) as and when required. But I wouldn't use chip oil in a million years !
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Hi All
Supposing you have reclaimed or purpose infused oil that has been created with ingredients such as onions, peppers and garlic with spices:
1) How long is it safe to keep for?
2) Where is the best place to store it? in an old oil bottle in the cupboard? in a fridge? freeze?
Thanks in advance
Russell
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Since I never read "use-by" dates, I would keep it indefinitely, in a sealed jar at room temperature. So long as there is a clear excess of oil over and above any water-based content, the oil will rise to the surface and act as a very effective barrier between the air (which might cause the water-based content to go off) and any water-based content. Even anchovies are normally well protected from going off by the oil in which they are kept, although honesty compels me to admit that I did once get food poisoning from a jar that has been open for well over a year ...
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Hi All
Supposing you have reclaimed or purpose infused oil that has been created with ingredients such as onions, peppers and garlic with spices:
1) How long is it safe to keep for?
2) Where is the best place to store it? in an old oil bottle in the cupboard? in a fridge? freeze?
Thanks in advance
Russell
I made about 1 litre of infused oil last weekend with the ingredients you mentioned.
The onion paste I froze in ice cube trays, the oil I returned to the plastic bottle and have put in the fridge I'm not sure how long it will remain safe- but I suspect it will all be gone in about 2 months.
Cheers
Matt
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For spiced oil containing garlic, amongst other things, you need to play safe regarding potential botulism spores.
I would keep spiced oil for no longer than a week or 10 days in a fridge.
Frozen it should be safe for a few months at least.
I froze my onion/pepper paste in one plastic tub. I find if I very slightly defrost it I can scoop some out with a texture like very hard ice cream. I then pop it back in the freezer.
I keep the oil in 500 ml plastic bottles and I find from the freezer the oil will turn back to liquid quite quickly at room temp. I then take the oil I need and put the bottle back in the freezer.
Paul
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Isn't botulism from garlic a risk only if the garlic is raw ? Once it has been cooked at 260F or above for a few minutes, the spores will have been destroyed, and they can't recur once the garlic is under a safe layer of oil. I was assuming that the original question referred to oil in which the ingredients had been cooked, but if that is not the case then I withdraw my earlier comment about "indefinitely" !
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Hi All
Just to clarify, the question is in regard to the oil itself that has either been reclaimed from the surface of the base gravy or a purpose made oil.
So it is essentially just the oil component, however there must be particles of the original ingredients in there with the oil, such as the onions, garlic etc. This leads to the question of how long it is safe to keep for and how best to store.
If it is likely to be fine for a month or two then no problem as it is unlikely to last that long before a new batch needs to be made anyway.
EDIT: Thanks for the advice guys. It is very likely then, that the oil will be used up long before there is risk of it going bad.
Thanks
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Isn't botulism from garlic a risk only if the garlic is raw ? Once it has been cooked at 260F or above for a few minutes, the spores will have been destroyed, and they can't recur once the garlic is under a safe layer of oil. I was assuming that the original question referred to oil in which the ingredients had been cooked, but if that is not the case then I withdraw my earlier comment about "indefinitely" !
Hi Chaa006, you might be correct there. The botulism spores (if present) get killed at about 122 degrees C. If the oil reaches this temp (I don't have a thermometer to measure oil temps) then all living spores or bacteria will be killed.
Maybe I'm being over cautious.
Cheers,
Paul
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Guys, guys... we're trying to recreate a genuine takeaway taste and experience... Botulism is our friend...
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Guys, guys... we're trying to recreate a genuine takeaway taste and experience... Botulism is our friend...
I have to say, that really is one of the funniest messages I have read for a long long time ! ;D ;D ;D
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Me too, it's only ever me that appreciates them though! ;D
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Maybe you could create a new authentic recipe : "Take 10?g salmonella, 100?g E. coli, 25?g botulism spores, and allow to fester in a warm kitchen for about ten days. Then, using the left hand only, gently knead these into the chapatti dough. Serve with 3-day old pilau rice on which aflatoxins have been encouraged to incubate."
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Well, I could; but it wouldn't be original. I ate a similar object in Lampeter in 1995.
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Where did my mu's go ? It showed 10?g, with greek letter mu, in the preview, but on posting they mutated into question marks :'(
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The board has adopted europian, fascist standards, it only does metric from now on....
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I have oily pickles made by Ahmed and Pataks
They have kept for a couple of years and not gone off
A couple went funny when we had some really hot weather
But that was ridiculously hot!!
So I would guess bottled spiced oil, in a fridge, will keep until you need it
I made the spiced oil on Saturday
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Ok, now I'm curious, could someone PM me the spiced oil recipe as well? :)
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Just google these 2 strings without the quotes:
"BIR Base Grabbi by Pete"
"Petes onion paste / spice fused oil"
It is free public information that Pete (sced) has kindly published.
Paul
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Be better with the quotes I reckon...
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Just google these 2 strings without the quotes:
"BIR Base Grabbi by Pete"
"Petes onion paste / spice fused oil"
It is free public information that Pete (sced) has kindly published.
Paul
Thanks Paul, interesting reading
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Well folks
I used this oil in some fried rice and it's amazing for that!
I've tried it in a base too, but I got too spiced out to know if it's worked 100%
I'll report back when I try it
One thing I am sure of, is that it is not the same as the old oil, that goes in bases I've seen
It has a totally different aroma
Far more fresh
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Hi Haldi,
The spiced oil is working well for me and has definitely lifted my curries to a newer level.
In hindsight I have not followed Pete's recipe to the letter because:
1) I didn't use quite as much spice mix, probably 4 tablespoons versus Pete's 6 tablespoons.
2) I didn't use the strongest, most flavoured oil containing the residue of spices for the base sauce, I just used the spiced oil that was clear of spice debris.
3) I didn't use a spice ball with GM type whole spices in the oil to be used for the base as I didn't have a spice ball. I have bought one since.
My oil is more of an orange/yellow colour compared to the photos of Pete's which is much more red.
I intend to experiment more with this as I believe that it may be the answer to my curry prayers. I've even bought a frying thermometer so I can experiment with the temps. I guess there is a possibility of burning the spices which would create quite a waste.
I'm a bit surprised that cr0 members have expressed so little interest in what may be a breakthrough technique, but I guess by my making reference to the other forum I've done the equivalent of dropping a stinky fart in a small lift full of people. Apologies if I have offended anyone by making such a reference but I thought this was too important to be petty about.
Paul
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Hi Paul,
I'm a bit surprised that cr0 members have expressed so little interest in what may be a breakthrough technique
I don't think that it's down to lack of interest, I've used spiced oil in the past and yes, I do believe that it lifts the dish to the next level. I think the lack of enthusiasm is probably due to the fact that it is not a proven BIR technique, as confirmed by the East webcam and the Malik webcam.
I also think that the method put's members off. If your gonna spend time in the kitchen cooking, generally, you want something to eat at the end of it.
If it's spiced oil that you want, and I mean really flavoursome, BIR smelling oil, simply add way too much to your final dish. Turn off the heat when done, and spoon off the excess oil. Strain this through kitchen towel and a sieve and store in the frifge for next time. I use this method to great effect and I know that Secret Santa does also. In Santa's own words "It's curry gold"
Ray :)
Ray :)
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Hi Ray,
I would agree that this is not probably what most BIRs do, i.e. specifically produce spiced oil as a process. Although the guys that Pete spoke to during their fag break alluded to the fact that they do make spiced oil as a separate process.
I think the spiced oil is probably a by product in most BIRs whether it comes from cooking a huge pot of base that may last for days, or spooning excess oil from curries back into the pot, or using bhaji oil or any other of these methods.
I think it's true though that it is an important element of the BIR taste and if you just cook a home-sized standard base with fresh oil and cook a standard curry using fresh oil again you won't be able impart enough flavour in the curry to match general BIR flavours.
Cheers
Paul
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Hi Paul,
I think your spot on, I believe it's a by product from their base. I don't think that they would spoon it from finished dishes, as the spice level in the oil would vary from dish to dish.
There is also the fact to consider that, each BIR will have it's own unique method, so the guy's that you spoke with on their ciggie break will, no doubt be correct, for their own gaff.
It does add something to the dish though, there is no doubting that fact whatsoever.
Ray :)
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I would go along with the current consensus : ever since I started using recycled oil (at all stages), there has been a significant improvement in flavour. W.r.t. the hypotheses as to whether BIRs make it as a separate process or as a by-product, I would incline to the latter. I think we all agree that an excess of oil is needed to make a good curry, and no BIR in its right mind is going to discard that oil as waste, so my bet is on "skimmings" becoming the recycled oil for the next batch.
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just read that grabbi post by pete, very interesting. it wouldnt suprise me if this is what goes on in some bir kitchens. it would account for the chicken taste in the real bir base i once purchased. any cr0 members tried this technique by pete? is it worth all the effort?
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just read that grabbi post by pete, very interesting. it wouldnt suprise me if this is what goes on in some bir kitchens. it would account for the chicken taste in the real bir base i once purchased. any cr0 members tried this technique by pete? is it worth all the effort?
Hi
Chicken taste? not quite sure where you are getting that from?
Apart from that though, I have just made a second batch of the oil myself and my personal opinion is that it is a magnificent discovery and intend to keep using it too!
EDIT: The effort required to make the spice oil is actually very small, the biggest pain in the ass is chopping the onions. Your best bet is to give it a go, the cost is only 2 or 3 pounds. Just be extra careful not to burn the spices at the end or the whole thing will have been a waste of time!
Cheers
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I'm due to make my second batch soon. For me it has worked very well and I intend to carry on using this spiced oil and onion/pepper paste. The preparation is probably a bit less time/effort than making a base although you still have to make a base gravy as well, of course.
Regarding the chicken flavour, this comes from using the oil to pre-cook your chicken.
Pete (sced) makes reference to this in his posts. This I haven't tried yet.
Cheers,
Paul
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ok guys i am sold on trying this. cheers
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I have knocked up some of Sced's spiced oil and will try with Dips Base and Madras tomorrow. I heated a little of the oil in a pan and got the most intense bir smell I have ever had at home. There is a very gentle bir taste as well but I anticipate this will intensify in the base and finished madras.
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Used the oil in my base and Madras and I must say that I am really impressed and gave a much deeper and more complex flavour than using normal veg oil. I think I need to tweek a few things when making the oil next time but I am definitely on the right path.
The oil was a browny colour rather than the expected red but I only cooked the spices in the oil for 15 minutes so may increase cooking time.