Curry Recipes Online
Curry Base Recipes => Curry Sauce, Curry Base , Curry Gravy Recipes, Secret Curry Base => Topic started by: Aussie Mick on April 07, 2012, 05:33 PM
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Just curious if anyone has given this a go yet?
A mate of mine is coming round to ours next Thursday and we are going to cook up a batch of base gravy (he wants to see it done....in the flesh so to speak)
I have cooked up CA's and Cewy's base gravy's and they have both produced excellent results with the final curry dish.
I'm tempted to try Julians base, but don't want to complicate matters too much if my novice mate is here to learn. I know Julian stresses the point that we really do need all that oil and very little water to make the proper BIR taste, but as I said, I am very happy with the bases I've already made up.
I'm very interested to hear opinions of anyone who has made C2GO base.
Cheers Mick
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I'm making the three litre Bangladesh version and I think it was Curryhell who was making some too
I cooked the base for about three hours, and the aroma DID change
I did get a sort of vinegar smell from it
Julian is right
I don't know how to exactly describe it
I just got to the point of thinking it was a waste of time, when it happened
I'll finish the gravy tomorrow and try a curry with it
Wouldn't it be great if this was the last piece of the curry puzzle!!?
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I'm making the three litre Bangladesh version and I think it was Curryhell who was making some too
I cooked the base for about three hours, and the aroma DID change
I did get a sort of vinegar smell from it
Julian is right
I don't know how to exactly describe it
I just got to the point of thinking it was a waste of time, when it happened
I'll finish the gravy tomorrow and try a curry with it
Wouldn't it be great if this was the last piece of the curry puzzle!!?
Blimey Haldi could this be it? My fingers are crossed!!
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Good luck mate.
We will "impatiently" await your results.
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Yes, same as Haldi. I did get a slight vinegar aroma. Will cook a curry with it tomorrow. Looks, tastes and smells really promising :)
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Interesting results.
The other week when i cooked for the party of 15, i had made a double portion of chewys base.
Cooked 2 lots of the 3 hour base, then combined (with a friends pot)as i havent got a large enough stockpot.
It was the first time i was using a base fresh rather than from frozen.
When i was cooking up the curries at the party i had the base simmering away with people coming up for a chat.
I was feeling quite disheartened and saying, "I'm not happy, the base smells too fresh and too raw".
All the resultant curries were delicious in the end and i had nothing to worry about.
So,,,, does it mature in the freezer>??
Does the aroma change when cooked from frozen, as this longer c2g cook does?
Cheers, Frank.
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Well the base was finished yesterday and i've made 2 phalls with it this afternoon. Followed exactly the same method as the Zaal video, just used a bit more gravy in the 2nd one. Verdict, i'm not going to give one now as i am obviously numb due to all the smells. I will try both a little later and will then leave in the fridge for a couple of days during which no curry cooking will take place and then reassess the dishes. Whilst i think there will be marginal improvement for the time spent in the freezer i don't think that is the reason for a curry to suddenly morph into a BIR dish. I beginning to think now it's more to do with exposure during the cooking and being inmersed in all the aroma's. Sensory overload. I'm sure some will disagree but that's my thoughts on the matter. I'm off for a pint or two.
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Good stuff Curryhell. Looking forward to hearing yours and terramambas opinions.
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Made the 3 litre base today also got that smell :)
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Made the 3 litre base today also got that smell :)
Which "smell" is that, please, timeless? Do you mean a "vinegar smell"? If so, bizarre! :o
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Curry2go Bangladeshi Style Base Sauce Three Litre
I
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Can I ask exactly how long did you cook the onions for??? thanks Jb
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Made the 3 litre base today also got that smell :)
Which "smell" is that, please, timeless? Do you mean a "vinegar smell"? If so, bizarre! :o
Vinegar taste/smell/aroma in a bir dish would be the last thing you want ;D, ....weird indeed!
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Can I ask exactly how long did you cook the onions for??? thanks Jb
Hi JB, I really wish I could give you an exact answer, truth is, bloody ages ::) in the accompanying video, the onions when knifed should offer no resistance at all, at a guess it was probably about two hours, maybe bit more. Sorry I wish I could be more helpful. They were very, very soft. :)
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Verdict, I'm not going to give one now as i am obviously numb due to all the smells. I will try both a little later and will then leave in the fridge for a couple of days during which no curry cooking will take place and then reassess the dishes. Whilst i think there will be marginal improvement for the time spent in the freezer i don't think that is the reason for a curry to suddenly morph into a BIR dish. I beginning to think now it's more to do with exposure during the cooking and being immersed in all the aroma's. Sensory overload. I'm sure some will disagree but that's my thoughts on the matter.
I'm agreeing with the above
I honestly can't tell any major difference from my made curries
They seem very bland
I would so like this to be the end of my search
It doesn't feel like that yet
Maybe in two months when I try one from the freezer, It will blow my mind
Hope so
Which "smell" is that, please, timeless? Do you mean a "vinegar smell"? If so, bizarre! :o
Sorry to butt in, on this, but I got this aroma
It was about two and a half hours from the start of cooking
I was checking for it every quarter of an hour or so
The smell just changes to an almost sour
Perhaps vinegar is not a good analogy, but I can't think of a better one
It is a recognisable Takeaway smell
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I have made this 3ltr base but using the pressure cooker method, i would describe the smell as going from a bit acrid to a deep savoury smell, it was my 1st go with the newly purchased p.cooker and wasnt entirely sure about the heat setting, but the smell seemed to happen after about 35 mins and when the lid came off, the contents were soft as ive ever got them to. The resultant curries were delicious and noted on CH's NIS thread
W
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I have made this 3ltr base but using the pressure cooker methodW
If I make this again, I'll try a pressure cooker
Saves a lot of time
I would like to see this Syrupy deposit at the bottom of the pan
That never really happened, cooking it the way I did
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I have made this 3ltr base but using the pressure cooker methodW
If I make this again, I'll try a pressure cooker
Saves a lot of time
I would like to see this Syrupy deposit at the bottom of the pan
That never really happened, cooking it the way I did
I have made this base twice now, the 1st time was a couple of months ago watching his youtube video and i got the spicing and texture wrong so didn't come out great, however the bit that truly amazed me which i believe i did get right was the original cooking of the onions, after about 2 and a half hours you could literally see the sugars oozing from the onions, another mistake i made though which wasn't pointed out in his video was i left the lid off the pan which would result in loss of heat and some liquid reduction. The whole process seemed to take hours.
The pressure cooker method is the way forward for me as the softness of the ingredients after such a short time need to be seen to be believed :)
In fact i'd be made up if someone were to start a new thread ("anything other than curry") of course, with pressure cooker recipes. Ive just made a chilli in no time!
Anyway i wont take it off topic any further, point is I'm sold on pressure cooker base ;)
W
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Just used my last two portions of c2go base that I made from Julian's video a month or so ago,there is a definite smell from this base that I haven't noticed with any other base I have made but I would describe it as ' peppery' type of smell.
Also using Julian's spice mix and although a very nice curry no 'eureka' moment I'm afraid :(
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a very nice curry with no 'eureka' moment I'm afraid :(
ditto
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"A very nice curry" sounds good to me though.. :)
CA and Cwewy's recipes also give a very nice curry.
I'm gonna get meself a pressure cooker tomorrow and give this one a go. :)
I wish we had an Argos here in Perth though. Cheapest I have found here is $175 for a 9.5 litre pan.
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"A very nice curry" sounds good to me though.. :)
CA and Cwewy's recipes also give a very nice curry.
I'm gonna get meself a pressure cooker tomorrow and give this one a go. :)
I wish we had an Argos here in Perth though. Cheapest I have found here is $175 for a 9.5 litre pan.
Here's my expectation or prediction, for what it's worth - my hunch is that, in six months time, pressure cookers will have been forgotten or put back in the cupboard in terms of cooking base sauces or anything to do with BIR food. C2G may have found a time-is-money type saving by using a pressure cooker in business but I doubt very much if equal or better results can't be obtained by cooking at normal pressure for normal times like almost every other BIR does. If pressure cookers are essential in this context why haven't they been seen much before in BIRs?
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"A very nice curry" sounds good to me though.. :)
CA and Cwewy's recipes also give a very nice curry.
I'm gonna get meself a pressure cooker tomorrow and give this one a go. :)
I wish we had an Argos here in Perth though. Cheapest I have found here is $175 for a 9.5 litre pan.
Here's my expectation or prediction, for what it's worth - my hunch is that, in six months time, pressure cookers will have been forgotten or put back in the cupboard in terms of cooking base sauces or anything to do with BIR food. C2G may have found a time-is-money type saving by using a pressure cooker in business but I doubt very much if equal or better results can't be obtained by cooking at normal pressure for normal times like almost every other BIR does. If pressure cookers are essential in this context why haven't they been seen much before in BIRs?
Good point George.
It's not like they don't know about them. Almost every Indian household uses a pressure cooker. ;)
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"A very nice curry" sounds good to me though.. :)
CA and Cwewy's recipes also give a very nice curry.
I'm gonna get meself a pressure cooker tomorrow and give this one a go. :)
I wish we had an Argos here in Perth though. Cheapest I have found here is $175 for a 9.5 litre pan.
Here's my expectation or prediction, for what it's worth - my hunch is that, in six months time, pressure cookers will have been forgotten or put back in the cupboard in terms of cooking base sauces or anything to do with BIR food. C2G may have found a time-is-money type saving by using a pressure cooker in business but I doubt very much if equal or better results can't be obtained by cooking at normal pressure for normal times like almost every other BIR does. If pressure cookers are essential in this context why haven't they been seen much before in BIRs?
I dont disagree with you there george, and agree that the pressure cooker method isn't going to give you better results than the conventional method. If my days were to be spent working 8 hrs in a takeaway then conventional cooking would apply, however, trying to juggle an already busy working day along with bringing up a family, then saving a couple of hours making a base sauce works for me ;)
W
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Same here Whandsy.
I'm looking at it as a time saving devise. As Dal Puri has said, I don't know any Indian household that doesn't own a pressure cooker. It's an essential item. Lentils can be cooked in minutes rather than hours. The gas savings alone are worth it, let alone time savings.
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saving a couple of hours making a base sauce works for me
Despite my reservations, after reading some of the positive comments about results from using a pressure cooker, I must try it. I'm primarily interested in flavour, rather than time-saving.
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The smell just changes to an almost sour
Perhaps vinegar is not a good analogy, but I can't think of a better one
It is a recognisable Takeaway smell
Possibly Haldi, I have heard of onion souring soups through a long cooking process, never experienced it though either in soup or base gravy
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I don't know whether removing the fibrous stuff from the base is a good idea,there could be flavour in it and you would be removing it ??? you wouldn't notice this stuff in a final curry and I cant imagine many BIR's sieving their giant pots of base,just my opinion :)
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saving a couple of hours making a base sauce works for me
Despite my reservations, after reading some of the positive comments about results from using a pressure cooker, I must try it. I'm primarily interested in flavour, rather than time-saving.
George
Just to give you my opinion after having used a pressure cooker for a couple of months.
I cannot detect any flavour / taste difference when cooking a base gravy, purely a time saver.
Cubed meat, lamb, beef (I don't bother with chicken because it takes so little time anyway) cooks to perfection in 15 minutes but no improvement or difference flavourwise from normal pot cooking.
I can vouch for using a high pressure cooker (15 or 16 psi insted of 7 psi for low pressure) but again this is a time saving issue not a flavour one. I did use a low pressure cooker years ago but cooking times were not drastically reduced compared to HP.
Time can obviously be translated into money, 15 minutes instead of 1.5 to 2 hours saves a lot of gas but in the scheme of things unless you cook all or most of your food in a P cooker not an important point.
However using the P cooker does allow me to cook up a meat curry 'on the spur', assuming I have a stock of frozen gravy etc. It only takes 30/45 minutes from scratch to table, you couldn't do this by pot cooking meat.
Anyway I hope this helps with your decision to buy or not.
Regards
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My mate Heston says
The foundation of so many soups, sauces is a good stock and a Pressure cooker really maximizes the amount of flavour you can extract from a stocks ingredients Because its a sealed, pressurezied container, it holds on to lots of the flavour that normally evaporates when you make stock in a stockpot. It heats liquid to a temperature above 100c generating lots of reactions that produce new complex flavours, a pressure cooker is the stock makers secret weapone. It might seem a big outlay for a piece of equipment to make stocks, but once you've tasted the results, you will see it is worth it.
Signed Heston.
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Sorry for my feedback on the recipe being so delayed. Anyway, last night I warmed gently my second phall made with Julian
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CH, i have to ask you what you're using for an apostrophe?
Are you using the one with that doubles up with the @ symbol on the keyboard which is the correct one.
Been meaning to ask for months :P
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Strange question DP but for an apostrophe the one that doubles with the @ key. For quotation marks the one that doubles with the 2 key. Why?? :-\ ;D
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Is it only me that see's your posts like this? ???
(http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/pics/3df88dcc25a46f097b4b2ce9fd9df577.png)
This is a screenshot by the way just to show what's replacing the apostrophe's.
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you been on that homebrew again DP. I hear specsaver have a good offer on at the moment. Mmm, interesting though. Maybe others can comment. When i view and preview my posts they appear fine. They also appear fine on my work laptop as well. Very strange. That doesn't alter my current curry dilema though >:( ;D
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Nice detailed Post CH and sorry you didn't get a good result. I think the same thing has happened to me whereby adding more (oily) base and reducing just made the curry oilier but without the body of the sauce forming. I mean I like an oily curry but there is a limit.
Since the whole Fleet 5 episode I've re-evaluated my position on making curries, changed my kit from wok and spatula to ally pan and chef spoon and I've had a few disasters and lost my curry mojo along the way :o
In particular my consistency has weakened.
Over the weekend I used the last of CA's simple base and started a simple vegetable curry with a few tablespoons of virgin coconut oil. The result was unexpectedly delicious and my wife and I were purring away as we ate it.
Nobody said this would be easy ;)
Paul
BTW I see the funny characters in your last post as well as Dalpuri.
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I'm so disappointed that the initial results on this base are just ok,I really thought this was going to be it,why the sauce won't thicken is a mystery.I'd still like someone who lives near Julian's place to try a selection of his food,at least we can work out what we're aiming for.
No homebrew for me Curryhell but I see exactly the same thing as Dalpuri,noticed it a while ago on some of your posts apologies I should have said something.I use the same keys as you described so I have no idea why your posts look a bit strange. :-\
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My last curry was your NIS CH with julians base and was well impressed, perfection for me. I'm trying a jalfrezi tomorrow night so will see how that goes.
I see funny symbols on your posts too :o
W
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hi ch sorry to hear u had bad results wiv julians base but if you remove the oil and continue to reduce lol until you get desired consistency? alternative i have a leccy knob and hate it with a passion! i would rather use my 10 pounds gas camping stove it only throws out 2kws but will more than do the job in half the time the knob will and you can control the temperature at the touch of the knob LOL! and the other plus is that you can do what the takeaways put down newspaper to save on the mess over your hob.
regards
gary
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So not only has the bloody gravy gone to pot, so has the f*****g keyboard >:( >:( ;D
Sorry about my funny characters gents. but you'll just have to learn to live with them for now. I will investigate and try and rectify.
Thanks for the crumbs of comfort Paul. Its (left the apostrophe out on purpose before anybody complains about my grammar) not only me that has this problem with oily bases then? I feel so much better already ::). Appearance wise everything about the first curry was right. It just refused to thicken >:(
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I'm so disappointed that the initial results on this base are just ok,I really thought this was going to be it,why the sauce won't thicken is a mystery.I'd still like someone who lives near Julian's place to try a selection of his food,at least we can work out what we're aiming for.
No homebrew for me Curryhell but I see exactly the same thing as Dalpuri,noticed it a while ago on some of your posts apologies I should have said something.I use the same keys as you described so I have no idea why your posts look a bit strange. :-\
Thanks for the words of consolation Jason. I too initially thought i was on to a winner. Maybe that is the consistancy of curries in some places but i am used to adjusting mine to suit ??? Re. key board if people can let me know when it seems to be happening, it'll give me an idea where to look to sort the issue. It must look like i'm permanently pissed while i'm typing to some ;D
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CH
I think you'll find it's a simple case of too much oil in the pan to start with.
I've made this mistake a couple of times and it just crucifies consistency and flavour, also it's not easy to rectify. I find that the spices won't cook properly in too much oil.
Removing the oil after it separates and then reducing doesn't seem to work either, just no flavour.
Maybe this is your answer, good luck
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My last curry was your NIS CH with julians base and was well impressed, perfection for me. I'm trying a jalfrezi tomorrow night so will see how that goes.
I see funny symbols on your posts too :o
W
As long as you're happy with the results W that's great. Maybe it was an off day for me :-\. But plenty more gravy to play with to find out ;D I will persevere with the phall and see if i can bring this gravy to heal ;)
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i have a leccy knob......
Not interested in your personal problems Gary ;D ;D ;)
If all else fails i will get out my portable stove and give the gravy a good thrashing on that to see if i can bring it under control ::) I so wish i had gas but i really don't think the medium of heat here is the issue. Maybe it's the chef :-\
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CH
I think you'll find it's a simple case of too much oil in the pan to start with.
I've made this mistake a couple of times and it just crucifies consistency and flavour, also it's not easy to rectify. I find that the spices won't cook properly in too much oil.
Removing the oil after it separates and then reducing doesn't seem to work either, just no flavour.
Maybe this is your answer, good luck
Knowing there was a lot of oil in the base i was very frugal with the amount i used to start the curry. The opposite is also true. Not enough oil and you won't singe them spices, which i think is absolutely essential to be in with a chance of producing a reasonable curry. I think it's easier to remove oil added at the cooking stage as it doesn't seem to merge into the sauce but just come out with cooking. Whereas a base made with loads of oil, it just seems to stay in the gravy and stop the thickening process ??? :-\
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CH,just trying to work out what could be wrong with the base and wonder if it could have been a lack of water as when you cook down the base in the final dish it's the water in the base that is being 'cooked out' and if there wasn't enough water this might explain why you had so much oil coming to the surface,dunno :-\ just a thought. ;)
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CH,just trying to work out what could be wrong with the base and wonder if it could have been a lack of water as when you cook down the base in the final dish it's the water in the base that is being 'cooked out' and if there wasn't enough water this might explain why you had so much oil coming to the surface,dunno :-\ just a thought. ;)
Hi emin-j. I too have gone over my cooking of both dishes and have thought about the process time and again. The thing that give a sauce it's thickness is the solids in suspension ie, the pureed veg. As the water in suspension vapourises the sauce should thicken. But it would seem that while some oil will separate out some continues to remain in suspension and maintains the viscosity which is what we're trying to reduce. Maybe we need to get a chemist to analyse the process. Much more of this and i'll need a bloody phychiatrist :o :o ;D
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IMHO too much oil forms a barrier around what is essentially/primarily a water based base sauce thereby inhibiting a reduction because the water based element cannot get actual/full contact with the surface of the pan and thus cannot properly evaporate/reduce by giving off steam.
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Now that is very plausible Paul and my train of thought too. If that's the case, it would explain why i couldn't reduce the thickness of the gravy but at the same time some water remained which prevented my from frying the shite out of what was left and burning it. This is what should have happened if i'd have managed to evapourate all the water, which obviously i didn't inspite of the intense heat and prolonged frying. Therefore the moral of this must be to only use so much oil when cooking the base or you'll never be able to thicken the sauce. I eluded to this when i drew the comparison between this base and the Taz base. I'm feeling happier now ;D
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Now that is very plausible Paul and my train of thought too. If that's the case, it would explain why i couldn't reduce the thickness of the gravy but at the same time some water remained which prevented my from frying the shite out of what was left and burning it. This is what should have happened if i'd have managed to evapourate all the water, which obviously i didn't inspite of the intense heat and prolonged frying. Therefore the moral of this must be to only use so much oil when cooking the base or you'll never be able to thicken the sauce. I eluded to this when i drew the comparison between this base and the Taz base. I'm feeling happier now ;D
Yeah CH
thats right
The thicker than normal/usual layer of oil prevents the steam escaping directly/normally , a bit like a protective skin
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Really appreciate the effort CH.
TBH, I find the opposite....curry too thick!!! I might try the smaller version of Julians base and see how it goes.
BTW, I see the hyroglyphics too. ;) :)
THANKS AGAIN for the detailed report
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Really appreciate the effort CH.
TBH, I find the opposite....curry too thick!!! I might try the smaller version of Julians base and see how it goes.
BTW, I see the hyroglyphics too. ;) :)
THANKS AGAIN for the detailed report
thanks Mick. I wish i was having your problem with the thickness >:(
Alchemy and witchcraft is afoot I fear :o ;D
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Thanks for all your input guys. I keep wondering if i've overdone something or not done enough ???. It has certainly given me some food for thought (but not as tasty as i would have liked :() . I have a couple of ideas to try out. If i manage to unlock the water from the base I may then be able to get the true flavour from the gravy :-\. Until i find the key and can achieve this the true taste of the Julian's C2G base may remain hidden forever :'( :'(
My scores of 5 / 6 could leap considerably ;D .
Maybe Julian would care to comment and maybe tell me where i've gone wrong? ;)
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Well, I got meself a pressure cooker. For anyone in Perth, $79 at Prime Indian supermarkets for an 11 litre pan........really happy with that. It's a Sonex Elite, made in Pakistan.
Well, I have decided to do another batch of CA's or Chewy's tomorrow to teach my mate the ropes. I'll probably follow Chewy's pressure cooker instructions. (Probably best, as I've never used one before and the instructions are pretty vague....I don't understand Arabic/Urdu).
Then next time when I am due some base, I'll give Julians a go in the pressure cooker.
Good to read all these opinions.
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Well, I got meself a pressure cooker. For anyone in Perth, $79 at Prime Indian supermarkets for an 11 litre pan........really happy with that. It's a Sonex Elite, made in Pakistan.
Well, I have decided to do another batch of CA's or Chewy's tomorrow to teach my mate the ropes. I'll probably follow Chewy's pressure cooker instructions. (Probably best, as I've never used one before and the instructions are pretty vague....I don't understand Arabic/Urdu).
Then next time when I am due some base, I'll give Julians a go in the pressure cooker.
Good to read all these opinions.
G'Day Mick
That Pressure Cooker looks spot on and cheap, Really simple to use mate (PCooker Envy) :P
I rigged the cam up again the other day, while I did a quick 1hour base.
A good one to show your mate as it's what I call an "All in One" base, using branded powders.
Very little spicing, producing a nice neutral flavoured base for your kangaroo curries. ;)
I'll upload it too my Vimeo account today, so you can have a butchers.
http://vimeo.com/mikestyne (http://vimeo.com/mikestyne)
cheers Chewy
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Thanks for all your input guys. I keep wondering if i've overdone something or not done enough ???. It has certainly given me some food for thought (but not as tasty as i would have liked :() . I have a couple of ideas to try out. If i manage to unlock the water from the base I may then be able to get the true flavour from the gravy :-\. Until i find the key and can achieve this the true taste of the Julian's C2G base may remain hidden forever :'( :'(
My scores of 5 / 6 could leap considerably ;D .
Maybe Julian would care to comment and maybe tell me where i've gone wrong? ;)
Hopefully the man will be along when he's finished another stint at C2G, but in the meantime, speaking as one who recently knocked up 15L of Julian's base*, all I can say is that, like many other bases I've made over the years, it worked well. No problems with reduction in the final curry, etc.
*The only thing I did differently was to fry (bhagar) the spices along with the blended toms and some extra g/g paste at stage two. Otherwise it was low and slow and by the book.
Sometimes though, despite your best efforts, bases can be right bastards. I've had to ditch many a base in my time, yet I remain mystified as to why they've not turned out like their forebears. They had the same ingredients, in the same pan, and were cooked for the same length of time on the same cooker using the same heat, but for some reason they just didn't turn out right.
But I'm guessing we're not alone in this, CH, so chin up and crack on with another!
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You're a legend Chewy. Mucho appreciated again. I'll sit down tomorrow with me mate and view this before we start. Might even have a beer or 3 as we go.
Mr. Dhali, when I am as experienced as you, I'm sure I'll know what you're talking about. 8)
I think the HUGE difference here for us colonials, is the fact that we have gone soooo long with very mediocre and overpriced stuff.
I have cooked up curries using Chewy and CA's bases and the curries tasted superb to all who ate them. It's only now, after a few weeks (I am on my 6th batch tomorrow,) and having consumed a good few ruby's, I am starting to be a bit critical.
Still, what I have cooked up (thanks to you good people) is still WAY superior to the local stuff.
God bless Cr0 and all who sail in her!! :)
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and you won't singe them spices, which i think we all agree now is absolutely essential to be in with a chance of producing a reasonable curry
I'm not so sure about that CH (particularly that you can possibly think that we ALL agree that it's "absolutely essential"!).
As someone else pointed out (I think it was George - and I have to agree) you don't seem to be "singeing"much, at all, in your "Zaal" demos? Because, unless I'm wrong, you add the tomato paste/puree BEFORE you add the spices?
AND you don't actually, thereafter, it seems to me (from your videos), cook the resultant emulsion for very long thereafter (despite the relatively high heat output)?
I would agree that it IS important to cook the spices sufficiently to extract their volatile oils (and, probably, to caramelise the other ingredients)......But "singeing"? ??? I have my doubts about that.
So that's one of us off your "all" list ;)
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So that's one off your list of "all" ;)
And I'm so disappointed CA ;) . I have now edited my post so it's clear that it's MY opion, although i'm not alone in this belief. But to say "we all" on this site is a serious misdemeanour and i have been duly corrected. Though, I do find it strange that you want to talk about what happened at Zaal's in this thread :-\ There are ample opportunities in the Zaal threads and there has been loads of time to discuss and challenge the video content and subsequent narrative or to raise questions or to make observations ??? So rather than take this thread further off topic i'm sure many would enjoy discussing this technique, however you wish to term it, it's worth etc. etc somewhere more appropriate. In the meantime i'll return to the problem in hand.
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Hi curryhell, I'm pretty much settled now that subtle differences in base gravies are neither here nor there when the strong flavoured ingredients I'll add later will dominate. I read Julians book yesterday, where I'll have to hand it to him regarding the effort he has put into it, I won't make his base gravies as i'm pretty sure they won't tell me anything new.
The most important piece of information I took from his book is related to what's been termed singeing, which is to remove the acidity from the tomato paste & in my view the spice mix which also taste acidic when undercooked. I'm not sure about releasing oils in the spice mix(who can tell when that's achieved?) ???.But I do know that if I don't remove the acidity at the frying stage, it'll be there until the end. It's probably causing lots bir@home cooks to turn out curries described as "not bir" The high heat commercial burners clearly do this far quicker than at home, & trying to replicate the cooking times shown on the kitchen videos may be causing even more problems. Cooking out the tomato paste may take even longer if using the tubed supermarket stuff, as that tastes even more acidic than the Salkim I use.
I've ruined many a great madras.........by adding too much lemon juice at the end ;D
Garam masala instead of MP, as in Ashoka produces some great curries as c2g has also stated
Would like to get c2g view on Vegetable ghee
**edit - cooking /singeing / releasing oils from the spice mix would take a hell of a long time at home,if ever on Julian's recipe's (1 TBSP) :o I've been using 1.5 tsp max ???
Regards
ELW
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Has anyone made the base with seasoned oil
I know Curryhell and myself didn't, but Julian emphasises it's importance
The trouble is the number of onion bhajees that have to go through the oil first
I mean, who could possibly, eat that many?
Is this why you can't make BIR curries at home?
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Is this why you can't make BIR curries at home?
I've never made seasoned oil or bhajis in my life Haldi, but can cook bir at home. Making banjarra paste & borrowing some of the oil to start the dish, would produce better results than seasoned in the base
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Has anyone made the base with seasoned oil
I know Curryhell and myself didn't, but Julian emphasises it's importance
The trouble is the number of onion bhajees that have to go through the oil first
I mean, who could possibly, eat that many?
Is this why you can't make BIR curries at home?
I made a batch of C2G base before Christmas according to the directions in his YouTube video (linked below) and used 2 no.250ml Bottles of chalice spiced oil: http://www.aak-uk.com/our-brands/chalice (http://www.aak-uk.com/our-brands/chalice)
How to make base gravy the way it's done in Indian Restaurants and takeaways (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5x4oIVzfQZ4#)
In fact I didn't achieve very good results with this base as it turned out very dark and in my judgement, too highly spiced. There were a lot of powdered spices added prior to boiling for a second time and it just didn't sit well with me. But I understand in the e-book there are alternative or additional base sauce recipes so maybe they are better.
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Personally I'm not a believer that you need spiced oil to make BIR at home, or anywhere else for that matter.
I went through a phase of using the recipe from sced on the rcr forum but after making it a few times I felt it wasn't the right direction for me.
I believe a combination of good mix powder, well cooked at the final stages, a good base recipe and probably the inclusion of some whole spices somewhere in the mix (I'm still undecided on that one) should be enough.
Having said that I might try reclaiming some oil from a base that has had extra oil added before blending.
Cheers,
Paul
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Ive just made the chicken tikka roshney with this base having followed the zaal lesson video and whilst i dont know what the original should taste like (as ive never had it before) the resultant curry, for me, turned out 100% bir :) and i would happily receive it in a restaurant no problem! The heavyish undertones of a homemade curry (for me the 5%) were not there, nor were they there for CH's NIS recently made. (sorry no pics of this one just demolished it ;D)
A BIG gravy lesson for me was the consistency, no doubt this is why some previous efforts were a little heavy and I have to say the 3 ltr base i made was a lot less spiced than when i first made it using the youtube video. I suppose thats the benefit of reading specific amounts as opposed to guessing pot sizes etc.
I have to say I, for one, am well made up with the results and whilst I feel i was always on the right lines, a few tweaks here and there have made me one happy bunny ;)
I just hope it continues and not just flukey :-\ ;)
W
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Hi curryhell, I'm pretty much settled now that subtle differences in base gravies are neither here nor there when the strong flavoured ingredients I'll add later will dominate.
Evening ELW. I share the same opinion as yourself. Gravies will only make a subtle difference to the overall taste, providing of course they are of a similar good standard. A naf one will stand out like a sore thumb :o
I read Julians book yesterday, where I'll have to hand it to him regarding the effort he has put into it, I won't make his base gravies as i'm pretty sure they won't tell me anything new.
Totall agree on the amount of work he has put in to the book. For newcomers to BIR it's better than anything widely available and deserves to be successful. I had no intention of making any more gravies for a while, but a couple of things he said just made me want to try it. Unfortunately, something went wrong. But as we all know, this does happen occasionally but we curry on regardless ::)
I took several things from the book as well as recognising little twists i'm already familiar with and quite a bit that is common knowledge among us die hards who've been at this home BIR game for a while. The one thing i really would like is to have a range with a similar output to a commercial kitchen. How much easier would it make the job of reproducing BIR at home? We can and do achieve it but it is a hit and miss affair which isn't helped by our domestic cookers :(
Then again, it is only a hobby and my living doesn't depend on it so i won't be losing any sleep :)
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Sometimes though, despite your best efforts, bases can be right bastards. I've had to ditch many a base in my time, yet I remain mystified as to why they've not turned out like their forebears. They had the same ingredients, in the same pan, and were cooked for the same length of time on the same cooker using the same heat, but for some reason they just didn't turn out right.
But I'm guessing we're not alone in this, CH, so chin up and crack on with another!
Never had to ditch one yet. I'll work on it SD. Even if i have to suffer the odd thinnish curry, all is certainly not lost. Curry no. 1 was acceptable, so a few lunchtime curries for work ;D. But you're right, onwards and upwards. Zaal base coming up and more technique practice ;D
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I have to say I, for one, am well made up with the results and whilst I feel i was always on the right lines, a few tweaks here and there have made me one happy bunny ;)
Whatever it is you're doing W, keep on doing it mate. You're obviously happy with the results you're getting and at the end of the day, that is really all that matters. Singe on (or is it singeing - another debate ;))
Best of luck
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Has anyone made the base with seasoned oil
I know Curryhell and myself didn't, but Julian emphasises it's importance
The trouble is the number of onion bhajees that have to go through the oil first
I mean, who could possibly, eat that many?
Is this why you can't make BIR curries at home?
Yes Haldi, I made the c2go base as per video with the seasoned oil also from memory the base had 'chef spoons' of ground spices and my chef spoon I think is bigger than Julians and it was the most ground spices I have ever used in a base gravy :o ,used the last of my c2go base on Monday along with Julians spice mix and although an OK curry nothing special :( will be making the Zaal next I like the spiced water instead of 1/2 ltr of oil !plus I will be using a chef's spoon of veg ghee in the base just to try.probably worse for my health than the 1/2 ltr of oil :-\
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I've botched a few bases, normally scaling down, bhagaring the tomato/garlic/spices & once by cooking the blended mixture in the slow cooker for too long.
When Az from Zaal said that domestic cooker versions may take a bit longer to cook, the cynic in me said no as usual, but logically correct, it would eventually reach the same stage. :(
I've changed my approach a little, looking to balance the taste of spice/tomato paste with the sweet onion gravy, or even tip the balance in favour of the gravy. On the tomato side , I may salvage a poor madras at best from it. On the gravy side or if there is a middle, I've got what I've been handing over my hard earned week in/out for decades ;D
From what I can see, c2g's recipe's call for 1TBLsp MP, which is nearly double what I normally add, leading me to believe that all along it's been a taste I've been trying to get rid ofin my curries, rather than introduce.
Acidic tomato was trumping the garlic/gravy in my failures
Edit-trumping the gravy, banjarra, masala sauce, magic sauce, south indian garlic sauce.....you name it
Regards
ELW
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;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D Gottcha. Thought i'd battle with the gravy once more and see what happened. Worse case scenario, average home cooked curry for lunch tomorrow. Not sure what went wrong on Saturday ??? but it all went very well tonight ;D. Put the base on the boil and cooked for another 10 mins and got some oil separation - good sign and the base was seeming to thicken - even better :D
Followed CBM's recipe but cooked it Zaal style with "singeing". Within a minute i knew this was going to work ;D Only the 2nd jalfrezi i've cooked and what a lovely little number it is.
(http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/pics/0b52bccf965e4ceb352ca6b1b173b34e.jpg) (http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/#0b52bccf965e4ceb352ca6b1b173b34e.jpg)
The taste of the curry is amazing and i will be having this little beauty a lot more. I've got to give it 8 / 10 for flavour and it can't all be down to the recipe ingredients. The base must be playing its part too. Full post here:
http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=5965.msg72723;topicseen#msg72723 (http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=5965.msg72723;topicseen#msg72723)
Next up has to be Julian's jalfrezi for a comparison I think.
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Well, we ended up cooking Chewys 3 hour base, but did it in the new pressure cooker in 35 min's.
A couple of mates turned up later and we rustled up a balti, dopiaza and a bhuna. We were all unanimous in that they were the best curry you could get in Australia.
I think my quest is over. It's the old "if it ain't broke don't fix it scenario." I think the presure cooker made a huge difference. The sauce was sweeter than normal, and obviously a lot of the goodness in the ingredients are retained by having a shorter cooking time.
I'll be sticking to this one............I think ???
Julians pillau rice is EXCELLENT. I've cooked this a few times now (in the rice cooker after the frying stage, I just add an extra 1/2 cup of water) and it really is bang on.
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Theres no pressure when cooking with a pressure cooker :D
Its easy
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Hi,
I've just followed the Curry2go base gravy recipe on page 37 of Julian's ebook
Followed it to the letter, I have noticed though how he asks for 4 or 5 chunks of root ginger on page 37 but then asks for 3 or 4 chunks of root ginger again in the spices list on the next page page 38!
When you look at the YouTube links for the same recipe he doesn't add the 2 doses of ginger and also adds the palm sugar at the end of cooking(not mentioned in the book)
Is it me being dumb here or a misprint
Cheers
Steve
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Not dumb mate, just observant. Another little glitch I think :)
One question though, regarding
" 4 - 5 2 inch chunks of root ginger"
Is this literally 5 pieces of ginger of 2" in length or are we talking about 4-5 slices of the stuff, as shown in the video which is considerably less? i'm a bit hesitant to add the former ;D
I asked the same question in another thread CM. No answer as yet. I certainly didn't see any "chunks" of ginger in the vids, only some slices of the stuff which is what i think Julian meant. Otherwise it would be a rather ginger tasting base :o
I went with 5 slices of the stuff in the end.
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I would say it's a definite "typo"
To be honest, I've started using jarred ginger and garlic paste (something I NEVER would have done when I was cooking curry BEFORE I had found this site. IE cooking curry without a base gravy) and I really cannot spot the difference between fresh and bottled.
If it's gonna be "boiled " up in a base gravy, the difference between fresh and jarred stuff will be unrecognisable IMHO.
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Thanks for the quick replies guys
I went half way in the end...... So if we ever meet up I don't want anyone call me ginger.... Honest :-)
Cheers
Steve
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Well,
I got the Curry2go ebook yesterday and today devoted the whole day to sourcing some recommended ingredients which I didn't already own
Made 24 portions of the Curry2go base mix which I'm happy with
The Vindaloo I made from the book resembled a Pataks Vindaloo I can only put this down to the whole lemon juice
As for the addition of fresh Methinks leaves I can't understand how this makes a difference
This is my second Vindaloo in 2 days I must admit CoryAnders Vindaloo which I made last night for the 8th time remains the KING of all currys which I have made over 30 years
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i got his e-book 2 weeks ago. 1st time its a bit of an ordeal. you have to make the spiced oil, then you make the mixed powder, then you get to make the base gravy. it turned out very good. my wifes baned me from the kitchen.
regards Rod (Down under)
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After giving it a fair try I feel the n
Book offers nothing really as this site does
The curry2go base sauce recipe was not as good as CA's base sauce IMO
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I'm dissapointed too
I rate the Taz and Abduls's recipes
It's worth the money to satisfy my curiousity
But it's no step forward
Perhaps this is a regional difference
It's probably just a good starting point
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Hi,
I'm new here and this is my first post.
I made Julians base (the one on youtube) and although I have not put it to use yet it seems to of turned out exceptionally good, more by chance than my cooking skills I hasten to add!
Upon reading through this thread I see some people use the pressure cooker...
For the base I am speaking of, it requires half a litre of oil + one cup of water.
I happen to own a pressure cooker and was considering using it for this base but the thought of cooking oil reaching in excess of 150 Fahrenheit doesn't seem too appealing to me. :-\
Would the lack of oxygen prevent anything major happening, knowing my luck Id probably be on the news tonight for blowing the building up. :'(
Can and should this be done??
Tom
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LOL Tom
I can't answer your question, as I don't know.
But now that you're here. Check out the recipes in the "base" section.
Easy to do in a pressure cooker.
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Lmao Tom
I did the base recipe as per the curry2go ebook using pressure cooker and same amount of oil and it was fine
I think the water mixed with the oil makes it safe.... It would be dangerous if you suddenly chucked cold water into oil though :)
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Thanks for the info,
I will be looking through the wealth of information available on this site.
I'm still not too sure regarding the pressure cooker though...
I will consider it when experimenting with the other bases at some time.
Thanks once again!
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Thanks for the info,
I will be looking through the wealth of information available on this site.
I'm still not too sure regarding the pressure cooker though...
I will consider it when experimenting with the other bases at some time.
Thanks once again!
Ive used the pressure cooker to make his 3 litre base no problem, and will do again!
W
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The Presssure cooker it is then... For the next time around!
Just made my first madras, I can only say that I found it a reasonable success for a first attempt, the chicken was very tender as I made it via the marinate and pre cook.
I suspect the base I made was a bit thick but I can gauge it a bit better on the next occasion.
I will try another base from this site for comparison next time when i have used up this batch.
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Hi all, thought i would give you my feedback on julians base, i tried the bangledeshi (sp) base and i must say it turned out brilliantly. The big key thing for me was the consistency of the base. I managed to get it to a fairly milk flow and it looked and tastes great.
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Done this base on saturday, i cooked on low for 3 hrs but still couldnt get that vinegary smell, i cooked a madras tonight and gotta say its the best curry i have cooked so far and probably better than some bir's, i was well happy.
I didnt use seasoned bhaji oil but i did use oil that i skim off from oily take away dishes and store in a pot in the freezer(only about 50ml), not sure if this made the difference.
Aslo used a tea spoon of mango chutney in the madras and this made a good difference to sweetness.
On the whole i think this is a good base sauce, i did sieve the sauce aswell and got a very good texture by blending for a very long time.
Fishy
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Good to hear you guys are having some success with it. I can't complain about my two chicken jalfrezis i've made using it to CBM's recipe either ;D
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Would the lack of oxygen prevent anything major happening, knowing my luck Id probably be on the news tonight for blowing the building up. :'( Can and should this be done??
I suggest there are at least two arguments against trying:
1. It goes against warnings on most pressure cookers, not to use them with such a low ratio of water to oil.
2. There are dire warnings of the danger on the Internet.
Just because one or two people try it a few times and nothing untoward happens, doesn't make it safe.
I'm saying the above as someone who used 100% oil to try cooking KFC type chicken in a domestic pressure cooker. But I took many precautions, and still consider it high risk.
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I personally am quite happy to continue using this technique, the pressure cooker takes a little time to get up to temperature and the vegetables are continually releasing water during the cooking process to such an extent that the resulting quantity of liquid has to be seen to be believed.
That said, each to his own :-\
W
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I have made this base and I found it very similar to the SNS base which I first made when I joined this forum. To be honest, I wasn't overley impressed and I still prefer Taz's base.
However, I do like the idea of sweating down the onions in Julian's method, so the next time I make Taz's base, I am going to sweat the onions down in the oil and a little water for about one and half to two hours before adding the other ingredients and finishing off with the Taz method just to see what/if any changes it makes :)
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I suggest there are at least two arguments against trying:
1. It goes against warnings on most pressure cookers, not to use them with such a low ratio of water to oil.
2. There are dire warnings of the danger on the Internet.
Just because one or two people try it a few times and nothing untoward happens, doesn't make it safe.
I'm saying the above as someone who used 100% oil to try cooking KFC type chicken in a domestic pressure cooker. But I took many precautions, and still consider it high risk.
Just to add to George's wise words of caution, I would like to report a highly dangerous occurrence in my own kitchen. I too made a high oil content base in a pressure cooker, and once the pressure had dropped to the point where the safety interlocks indicated that it was safe to open and remove the lid, I did so. All looked perfectly fine and tranquil in the pressure cooker. Then, totally failing to anticipate what was about to happen, I took my trusty wooden spoon and gave the base a stir. And I have never been so terrified in my life. The liquid, which was clearly at considerably over 100C, rose up in the cooker like a maelstrom. If it had been any higher, it would have gone over the top and my feet would almost certainly have been cremated. As it was, it just stopped short of the top, and I backed off like a scalded cat. When the turbulence had subsided, I gently and cautiously re-introduced the spoon, and the witch's cauldron effect re-occurred, at a slightly lower scale. Time and again, a gentle stir was all that was needed to cause all hell to break loose in the pressure cooker. And the explanation ? Well, oil is lighter than water, and boils at a far higher temperature. When the pressure has dropped in the pressure cooker, the water (below) is just below boiling point (whence the fact that no more steam is given off, and the pressure has dropped to a "safe" level that releases the interlocks). But the oil (above), which also has higher thermal inertia than water, is almost certainly well above 100C. But it doesn't give off steam, so the safety mechanisms are fooled into believing that all is well. But just the gentlest of stirs brings the near-boiling water (below) into intimate contact with the super-heated oil (above) and the results are terrifying : a boiling, turbulent mixture of oil, water and steam that occupies far more space than the individual components and rushes up inside the vessel and which could so easily overflow, if the original volume were more than about 1/3 of the capacity of the pressure cooker.
So, please bear this in mind : if you want to experiment with cooking high-oil-content bases in a pressure cooker, the choice is yours, but please please please take the greatest care once you have removed the lid, and do not stir until you are /certain/ that the liquid has cooled to a point where scalding (or worse) is no longer a possibility.
** Phil.
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Good warning post Phil, glad to hear you didn't get hurt. I noticed you haven't been posting here for a while.
Cheers,
Paul
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Scary Stuff Phil!
Has anyone made this base using the specified pressure cooker recipe?
I have bought one, but am waiting to finish my current stock of base.
-- Josh
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I have bought one, but am waiting to finish my current stock of base.
-- Josh
This pressure cooker stuff seems to me to be another red herring. It cant be normal BIR practice otherwise it would be well documented. I think you are all very brave to try this technique but also think you are all wasting your time & money. Good Luck peeps :)
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I have bought one, but am waiting to finish my current stock of base.
-- Josh
This pressure cooker stuff seems to me to be another red herring. It cant be normal BIR practice otherwise it would be well documented. I think you are all very brave to try this technique but also think you are all wasting your time & money. Good Luck peeps :)
Depends what your trying to get out of it Mickdabass, the reason I'm using one is the gravy now takes about an hour and a half start to finish, whereas it used to take me about 3 and a half hours for the same result ;)
As I've mentioned previously, long working hours, children, busy lifestyle etc, for me time is of the essence :)
W
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Same here Whandsy, and I am convinced that the pressure cooker bases that I have made are superior to the non-pressure cooker bases I have made. A lesser cooking time obviously keeps in a lot of the taste and goodness of the raw ingredients....IMHO.
I'm no expert, but I've cooked at least a dozen bases these past few months ( and have been cooking curries at home for 30 years.) I'm a recent convert to the pressure cooker, and I'll be using it every time in future.
I think the reason the restaurants don't use one is the fact that you cannot buy one big enough to cook up what a restaurant would need each day. They would need to do several batches.
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Heh Whandsy & Mick
I take your point. I have not tried using one...and as you say it depends what you are trying to get out of all this.
My goal is to try and replicate a BIR curry like the ones I used to enjoy in the late 70s & 80s. Its a bit of a strange goal though because I know I can make far tastier curries than I currently do by using fresh garlic etc, but thats not my aim
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I have tried the Curry2Go base gravy (3 litre version) and the result were ok. I have to say the smell was fantastic in the kitchen whilst cooking the base. When it got to cooking the curries, they were very good too. However, because I am still very new with BIR style have not got much to compare it against just now.
I am now in the final cook stage of the Bangladeshi 3 litre base which again smells fantastic. Tastes pretty good too! I will try and get around to cooking a curry tomorrow but may have to wait until later in the week. Plan for tomorrow is to cook up 2 batches of Pilau rice (500g per batch) and 1-2kg of Chicken to replenish my stocks. Probably half tikka, half plain.
I will post again when I have cooked a curry with the Bangladeshi base.
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Well, I cooked the C2Go Bangladeshi base. I have to say the smell was fantastic throughout cooking. Like others have mentioned, I never really smelt 'that' smell whatever it is so decided to stop the initial cook after about 2 hours (inc. 45 minutes heating time!)
This was the result before the blitz
(http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/pics/1140ad50ccd517416322669bb941b806.jpg) (http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/#1140ad50ccd517416322669bb941b806.jpg)
This was the result, post blitz before putting back on the stove....
(http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/pics/f9cf2c21b3327592e0a553e7c43eafb6.jpg) (http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/#f9cf2c21b3327592e0a553e7c43eafb6.jpg)
After roughly an hour, of waiting (im)patiently the oil finally starts to release...
(http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/pics/d4115bebf0eb59b7fb9a40a9eca42892.jpg) (http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/#d4115bebf0eb59b7fb9a40a9eca42892.jpg)
After a further half an hour I turned off the heat and waited another half an hour to see this.......
(http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/pics/4f646e4f29a601ad6d25035ca9e9a470.jpg) (http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/#4f646e4f29a601ad6d25035ca9e9a470.jpg)
A pretty good result on the base.... so packaged it up for the freezer (as well as keeping 1 or 2 batches aside for cooking later in the week ;) )
(http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/pics/56b29b1613209034a3283cbf70150a3b.jpg) (http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/#56b29b1613209034a3283cbf70150a3b.jpg)
Final Result.
(http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/pics/6c2fe7d0f7a2587e5a8aeacaa2299d15.jpg) (http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/#6c2fe7d0f7a2587e5a8aeacaa2299d15.jpg)
Will get some more pics on here later in the week. I have already cooked a Madras but have not taken pics. Will try to get some tomorrow!!
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Hi Tongey,
I am at the same stage as you or maybe just over a week ahead coz I've nearly finished all mine, I have three more cartons left.
I wish i kept note like you of the process throughout the whole episode but only logged the beginning and end.
My base tasted lovely but was a bit thick I think.
I brightend the photos up a bit as I sent them to my cousin to wind him up. ;D but I did come clean on this!
You seem to of yielded around the same amount as me so I'm posting my photo for you to see.
As for my finished curries they have tasted fantastic but not as photogenic as some of the ones I have seen on here so I will reserve the pics till a later date.
Anyway, not to detract from your superb results and post... Well done mate!
(http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/pics/393c26a4153c0984d9e0ecbca9397f81.jpg)
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Hi Tommy
Thanks mate, your gravy looking fantastic too :D
Glad your having good results with it! I have cooked one Madras with it and I have to say it taste really good. Will have to get a pic of it on here....
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As Im relatively new to curry cooking Ive only used 3 different bases up to now. One recipe I saw on youtube with tons of onions, garlic and ginger, and lots of water, CBMs recipe, and the C2go. So far, I think there is a lot of mileage in Julian's recipe and the techniques and ideas behind it. I liked the idea of using a pressure cooker and opted for a 4 L Prestige high dome, to use for the 3 L C2go recipe. Now what about that "taste", "smell" "aroma", "vinegar"? First time Ive used a pressure cooker so to I was a bit unsure of how much hissing should be going on. The smell of the seasoned oil was very dominant very soon after the heat was turned up and up to pressure. Spent some time hovering around the cooker sniffing away like a demented blood hound. Nothing noticed to start with, i.e. no change in the smell. I figured perhaps it would take longer due to the smaller pressure cooker (12 lb weight thingy). After about 40 mins still no change, so I thought Id let things cool and have a look to see what was happening. The onions were very soft. Lots of sweetness, more than Id experienced before. But I was using Dutch onions for the first time and thought they may be responsible, so I brought everything back up to pressure again. 15 mins later still no change in smell. The kitchen was still full of the seasoned oil smell, which is very nice btw and did smell like a curry house.
Id basically given up on finding the change in aroma and decided to switch off the heat (after popping outside for a breath of fresh air). Thing is, my extraction fan vents outside directly and once out in the fresh air for a couple of minutes I caught the smell from the vent. That was it. Distinct change in aroma! Difficult to describe it. I can see how Julian would use vinegar as a comparison, but it was somehow much deeper, acrid, and almost sulpher-like? Julian also mentions in his book sulphites amongst other being produced/released during cooking of the onions. I quickly ran in and took the pan off the heat. After letting things cool down again the lid came off and I was greeted by an unbelievable rich smell. The onions had darkened significantly. I guess this is just caramelisation (or partial caramelisation). Whilst giving everything a careful mix I found the dark "syrup" like substance at the bottom of the pan Julian refers to, and plenty of it. The taste of this sludgy stuff was clearly the source of the aroma. I havent seen this before using other base recipes/techniques. Has anyone else? Is it complete caramelisation or something else? Is this like the bunjarra? I haven't made any as yet.
Ive definitely produced my best curries so far using this base. Significantly better. But I havent by any means mastered the cooking of the currys themselves, and as curryhell said in an earlier post somewhere " .... a good base in the hands of someone with poor technique will at best product an average home made curry". A way to go for me yet but Ill be sticking with the C2go base. Looked a bit more into the relationship between sulpher-like compounds in food and found that "allyl propyl disulfide" is the principle substance in onion oil, which has a very pungent smell. Commercially made onion oil is apparently extracted from onion cores using a process involving steam. Perhaps this (in sufficient quantity) then is an intrinsic factor, or at least relevant in the BIR taste, specifically the base itself. Presumably oils from the other ingredients will also be produced, which then blend in to produce that elusive aroma found in good BIR? I suppose one argument against this is that bases tend to be fairly bland when diluted, although reduction when making the curry itself I gather is an important stage. Alternatively Im talking complete bollox. :)
Rob
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The only problem I see with your analysis getonthegarabi is that 99% of BIRs won't be using a pressure cooker to make their base sauces.
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Thanks for the fascinating information getonthegarabi. That's really interesting.
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The only problem I see with your analysis getonthegarabi is that 99% of BIRs won't be using a pressure cooker to make their base sauces.
Is that right? I guess possibly so given the large amounts of base needed in many cases and limitations on the capacity of pressure cookers. Perhaps the same result can be achieved without a pressure cooker, but with extended cooking time, how long I have no idea. It would be interesting to know if anyone else gets this oily syrup residue during prep of the onions/base using their chosen recipe.
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A good report getonthegarabi. Great news that you are having success with this base. I suspect the same affect will occur in non-pressure cooked bases, given that in many cases the onions have the living shite boiled out of them when you look at the burner used in one of CT's threads. When at Zaals high temp was used for the initial cooking of the base. I would think that the same release of sweetness would happen but would not be so obvious because of the use of more liquid used in the cooking. I think the term chef Az would use to describe it would be "when the onions melt" ;D. The Zaal base i cooked was the sweetest i've ever made in 20 odd years using various methods. Time i'd finished cooking the onions, they still resembled onions, but only just. They were ready to disintegrate or "melt" ;D
Carry on the good work and keep us posted on your results with the base and different dishes. The first time i used C2G's base the result was not great. But i learnt something from this experience and subsequent curries from using it have been very edible to really quite bloody good ;). My preference is still for the Zaal base with Abdul's enhanced being a close second. I still feel that i have a little bit of work to do yet in this area though. But this is all part of the fun. The bonus being you get to eat some damn fine curries into the bargain.
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Thank for the replies guys. Here are a few phone pics of the C2go base. The second pic is after the spice powders etc have just gone in. I then transfered the mix to a larger (5.9 L) pan. Not sure why I didnt do that first. When I do my next (third) batch I'll get some close-up pics of the dark oily syrup.
(http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/pics/4588aff93ac8f863b4685fcc44c8e314.JPG)
(http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/pics/30db447eaffff9eee11cc74892ae7635.jpg)
(http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/pics/6fe8ff5e3f6dfb2b01fbe7e8e59bccb9.JPG)
Not got many useable pics of actual curries as yet, but this is the C2go Vindaloo recipe made as the sauce to freeze down using leftover base. The pics arent great as they dont really show the lovely red colour imparted by the crushed dry Kashmiri chillies (got these online from a place called the spiceworks).
(http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/pics/8c6da828c2e1017db516475b6ff85b13.jpg)
(http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/pics/fe70475f8d53320d2736b018ac975445.jpg)
Just noticed I seem to have the same frying pan as Chef Nural at the Manzil. All I need now is some of his skills! Still, the sauce and the Chicken Vindaloos I made fresh earlier were mighty fine if I do say so myself. All feedback/suggestions much appreciated. It is great fun learning. Cheers, Rob.
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looking good there Rob you are defo on the right track keep it up mate ;)
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I stumbled across Julian's base sauce on Youtube along with some other recipes of his.I thought i would try his base sauce.I had over the preceding week cooked around 40 of Julian's Onion bhajis they were delicious.So i did cook the base sauce with seasoned oil from the bhajis.Got all the ingredients in a 4 litre pan and off i went,it took along time for onions to start cooking.Anyway i followed his recipe and waited for that particular smell and then it appeared!I decided to try one of Julian's curry recipes and chose a Chicken Jalfrezi.The end result was delicious.I have been eating BIR for the past 33 years and we all know when we get "that taste" .I thought i would let my 4 workmates try 3 Jalfrezis and a medium curry along with again Julian's Pilau rice obtained through buying his Ebook.We all sat down for dinner and took it in turns for the microwave.I waited in anticipation for their comments.They are all regulars at the BIRs and too have been eating curries for many years.The comments were superb ( 9 out of 10 ) i got and was well pleased! Since then they are requesting i make them curries for the weekend the orders are in.
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Late reply maybe but i cooked this and nowhere near bir, dont mean to be a critic, but no!
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Late reply maybe but i cooked this and nowhere near bir, dont mean to be a critic, but no!
What do think it needs to be closer to bir Steve? I find the c2go base nearer to bir than most of my local bir(s). But I am no expert.
Rob :)
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I find the c2go base nearer to bir than most of my local bir(s).
Would I be alone in having trouble getting my head around this one ?!
** Phil.
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A bir curry as you know has a distinctive taste, this is what im trying to capture, but for julians base im affraid it wasnt worth the time or effort as was a complete waste of time and money, as bases go i know that the base sauce tastes as your curry would as ive tried a bit from a takeaway but ask any questions about how its made they dont want to know, the only thing im getting a bit closer to the taste is by simmering a big bunch of corriander for and hour, let it cool and add the flavoured water to the base instead of tap water.
steve.
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A bir curry as you know has a distinctive taste, this is what im trying to capture, but for julians base im affraid it wasnt worth the time or effort as was a complete waste of time and money, as bases go i know that the base sauce tastes as your curry would as ive tried a bit from a takeaway but ask any questions about how its made they dont want to know, the only thing im getting a bit closer to the taste is by simmering a big bunch of corriander for and hour, let it cool and add the flavoured water to the base instead of tap water.
steve.
The c2go base includes fresh coriander (including stalks). How long did you cook the onions for? Also, from what I have learned on here, the distinctive taste you are looking for may not be attributable to the base alone.
Rob :)
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I may be wrong, but I'm not sure (by reading his recent posts) stevejet66 truly understands what a BIR base sauce/gravy actually is and how it is used, :-\
Steve are you mixing up a base sauce/gravy with the actual Curry sauce in a finished dish?
Martin
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Hi martin. no not getting mixed up with the final dish taste, but i can asure you that the base gravy i tryed tasted exactley like a final dish, the madina takeaway and the rose of bengal gave me the opportunity to try the base gravy, as the chef cooked my chicken curry takeaway he added base sauce to an pan, simmered for 5 mins, added the chicken/corriander simmered again topped up with more base gravy and finished with gara masala, nothing else was added, for bhuna/madras i know they do add the addition of garlic/g pepper/chilli etc. so what i had from the gravy pot was it. this is what im trying to achieve. as we would cook a stew we dont add it to another pan and throw all we can in it to make it better!.
steve
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[T]the madina takeaway and the rose of bengal gave me the opportunity to try the base gravy, as the chef cooked my chicken curry takeaway he added base sauce to an pan, simmered for 5 mins, added the chicken/corriander simmered again topped up with more base gravy and finished with gara masala, nothing else was added
Then, with the greatest respect, what he added was not "base gravy" but a ready-prepared curry sauce. This makes perfect sense, particularly in view of the fact that many of us believe that modern BIRs are lowering their standards, but it is not the technique that was "traditionally" used (if one can speak of a tradition that goes back only a few decades), nor is it the technique for which most recipes on this forum call. We use (and we believe that BIRs have traditionally used) an unspiced or very lightly spiced base (a light, blended vegetable soup containing onion, garlic, ginger, tomato, oil, salt, and perhaps some very mild spicing such as turmeric and paprika), to which it is essential to add spices at the time of cooking. These spices can either be added directly to the sauce (to which will have been added a substantial quantity of oil and the pre-part-cooked meat), as recommended by Kris Dhillon, or can be bhooned and then have the sauce and other ingredients added.
** Phil.
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Phil exactley, a ready prepared curry sauce, they change in colour if the chef addes red chilli powder/tom puree in to the pan to make it richer, redder/simmer longer to make it darker, this is what im trying to explain its a curry all done finished, its added to a pan to get heat hot for you to takeaway or eat in, go to any takeaway and ask for a curry sauce nothing added , youll see what i mean!
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Phil exactley, a ready prepared curry sauce, they change in colour if the chef addes red chilli powder/tom puree in to the pan to make it richer, redder/simmer longer to make it darker, this is what im trying to explain its a curry all done finished, its added to a pan to get heat hot for you to takeaway or eat in, go to any takeaway and ask for a curry sauce nothing added , youll see what i mean!
Yes, I'm very willing to believe that that is now often the case. Whether it can yield the flavour that some of us are seeking (which dates back to the 60s/70s) I am uncertain, but I am certainly willing to accept that the technique may now be widely used. From a logistical point of view, it makes perfect sense; but as to whether it can replicate or better the flavour that can be achieved by adding fresh spices to the final dish I reserve judgement.
** Phil.
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This is why im aiming for a cassarole style sauce like we would make a beef stew, even a vegitable stew with oxo and gravy granuals is lovely when its finished now its time to experiment with some of those asian veggies you see in the asian supermarkets youde never dream of cooking, we know onions/ carrots/parsins/leeks etc are part of the british stew. so its something they use we would need to experiment with,
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A few pics from making my last batch of c2go base. The first pic is completion of the first pressure cooking stage, prior to addition of the powdered spices, etc.
(http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/pics/becb7b7223636cd4c8eb0250dc5c35f6.jpg)
Below shows some of the oily residue taken from the bottom of the pan. There were significant amounts of this. Roughly, half an inch in depth covering two thirds of the bottom of the pan. This residue (described in Julians book) I would suggest is a type of intensely caramelized onion sauce/oil/bunjarra, intrinsic to the base, and this adds sweetness and depth to the taste in the finished curry.
(http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/pics/5a894232b5899f2269d16a7e184f6f4f.jpg)
Finished base; I did add some more water as the consistency was a little too thick this time.
(http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/pics/93e7e376abbc61c614c8a2ef930a62ce.jpg)
Rob :)
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Some weeks ago I was lucky enough to be invited onto the kitchen of my local t/a and watched them cook a chicken madras and was surprised to see no spice or salt added to the dish :o When I asked the chef about this he said 'everything is in the gravy,nothing extra is needed' ??? he also used no oil at the start of the curry and instead used a chef's spoon of base and fried this down before starting with the g/g etc etc.
I asked if I could make my lamb madras and he agreed,I started with a small amount of veg oil plus added about a heaped teaspoon of mix powder ( to his disapproval ;D ) when finished I tasted both and my curry was best ;D
Whether this 'all in the base' is a relatively recent practice I don't know but it might explain why t/a curry's seem to be
lacking in flavour compared to even a year ago :-\
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Some weeks ago I was lucky enough to be invited onto the kitchen of my local t/a and watched them cook a chicken madras and was surprised to see no spice or salt added to the dish :o When I asked the chef about this he said 'everything is in the gravy,nothing extra is needed' ???
What kind of shiting practice is this? >:( >:( >:(
I started with a small amount of veg oil plus added about a heaped teaspoon of mix powder ( to his disapproval ;D ) when finished I tasted both and my curry was best ;D
Why doesn't that surprise me ;D
Whether this 'all in the base' is a relatively recent practice I don't know but it might explain why t/a curry's seem to be lacking in flavour compared to even a year ago :-\
Indeed this could explain a lot. Thank god I learned to cook curry properly before this "curry in a hurry" approach takes over. Can you wonder at dishes taste very similar??
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Hi CH ;) the chef did say ' most of their customers don't like their curry's too spicy' ???
When the chef See's me come in he comes to the counter and shakes my hand 8) then adds extra spice to my curry's ;D
Perhaps we should start a new section ' Traditional BIR' ;)
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emin-j
This was the same approach i witnessed, and ive only ever been in 3 or 4 of kitchens over 30 years, and that was at a push! in 1996 i managed to get in the madina kitchen wednesfield/wolverhampton (now gone) and expected all the drums to be rolling as he was cooking, No didnt happen! pan/base/chicken/masala/corriandor/done. same as the rose of bengal high street bloxwich.
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pan/base/chicken/masala/corriandor/done. same as the rose of bengal high street bloxwich.
Is it possible that "masala" was not garam masala but what most on here call "spice mix" or "mix powder" ? That would be close to the Kris Dhillon methodology.
** Phil.
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Hi chaps, please bear in mind this section of the forum is specifically for posting recipes for curry base sauce, not for discussion threads about base sauce. There is a forum section for discussions about base sauce recipes, it is here: http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?board=82.0 (http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?board=82.0)
Keeping threads separated like this helps us all find stuff more easily in the future. Thanks very much.
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Hi chaps, please bear in mind this section of the forum is specifically for posting recipes for curry base sauce, not for discussion threads about base sauce. There is a forum section for discussions about base sauce recipes, it is here: http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?board=82.0 (http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?board=82.0)
Keeping threads separated like this helps us all find stuff more easily in the future. Thanks very much.
Good point. The c2go base recipe is not on here. Is it possible for a mod/admin to move this thread into the correct section?
Rob :)
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reposted
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Hi martin. no not getting mixed up with the final dish taste, but i can asure you that the base gravy i tryed tasted exactley like a final dish, the madina takeaway and the rose of bengal gave me the opportunity to try the base gravy, as the chef cooked my chicken curry takeaway he added base sauce to an pan, simmered for 5 mins, added the chicken/corriander simmered again topped up with more base gravy and finished with gara masala, nothing else was added, for bhuna/madras i know they do add the addition of garlic/g pepper/chilli etc. so what i had from the gravy pot was it. this is what im trying to achieve. as we would cook a stew we dont add it to another pan and throw all we can in it to make it better!.
steve
I'm so glad someone else has seen this
I was having the best curries of my life, at one place
It's now closed
But their curries were just base with a few minor things added to change them to all the different curries on the menu
You know, add a bit of chilli for a vindaloo, more chilli for a madras or add some fried garlic paste & peppers to make a rhogan josh
The base on it's own was an absolute knockout
This is the 70's & 80's style curries I am talking about
The secret?
Well, it's been well covered and it's very controversial
But it's the oil used in the base
It's deeply flavoured by everything that's been cooked in it
The base is really just onions and water, but with this amazing oil
I have been there, when it's been prepared
The onions are boiled with water, a little spice and salt for a couple of hours
Then the oil is added and it's cooked for another couple of hours
And Wow!
You should smell this cooking when the oil is added
It's an immedate effect
It's the aroma that fills your car, when you are driving home with your takeaway
It's the smell that's on the takeaway bag
Wonderfull stuff
They scoop off oil as much as possible, after cooking and this is kept back for frying curries
And the boiled onions are blended to make the finished onion gravy
And it tastes absolutely amazing
If I could make that, I would die a happy man
This is why so many of us here, have struggled to find the "missing" flavour
We've all tried the "adding spices" idea, and all that will do is take you further away from what you want
It is so simple and impossible to copy without cooking huge volumes of fried foods
It CAN'T be done at home
And I have really tried
All this new style BIR food is made with fresh oil
And let's face it, that's a really good idea
It's a lot healthier, but unfortunately tasteless
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You know, add a bit of chilli for a vindaloo, more chilli for a madras
Are you sure you have that in the right order, Haldi ?!
** Phil.
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LOL it is early phil, yes i agree with the oil bit, i have know them use oil from frying onion bharjees, but as i say go to any takeaway and ask for a sauce nothing added, youll find that bir currys have always been cooked like this, what they have cooked in that pan is it,,,with the addition of peppers/chilli/puree/g masala to make a paticular dish.
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Rather than continue the oil debate here I suggest we do so in a more appropriate area of the forum. This thread has become a little bit de-railed since it's meant to be about discussing Julian's base. An ideal place for continuing this I would suggest is
http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=8347.0 (http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=8347.0)
It's a very interesting read but alas, no conclusions as yet :-\
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You know, add a bit of chilli for a vindaloo, more chilli for a madras
Are you sure you have that in the right order, Haldi ?!
** Phil.
Yes
Weird I know
But round here, a Vindaloo is a standard mild curry
NOT hot
On the other hand, a Madras will take your head off!!
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Yes, Weird I know, But round here, a Vindaloo is a standard mild curry, NOT hot, On the other hand, a Madras will take your head off!!
Wow, I had better take care if I visit your town ! Where do you live, Haldi ?
** Phil.
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Hi all,
Now I am quite new here and I am getting quite quite confussed. I have never made Julians base, though I was considering it untill I read the negative comments here. Different bases seem to be so vastly different. I have been using KD base for a number of years and have mostly been pleased with the resultant curries, would there realy be a big differents in my curries if I changed to one of the multitude of bases out there? I am cooking for friends at weekend and will be using recipes from KD, CBM and C2G. I can not wait to the responses to this one!
Roger.
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I have been using KD base for a number of years and have mostly been pleased with the resultant curries, would there realy be a big differents in my curries if I changed to one of the multitude of bases out there? I am cooking for friends at weekend and will be using recipes from KD, CBM and C2G. I can not wait to the responses to this one!
Roger.
Sorry I can't give a definitive answer Roger. The only person that can do that is yourself. We all have our own opinions on KD, C2G and several other bases and we all have our own preferred (and sometimes adapted) bases. It is very much what works for the individual and that tends to be based on the results obtained. What i will say though is if you try another base, your curries will not be poorer for the change from KD, IMHO ;) CBM's recipes are very good and C2G's have received some good feedback, probably more than his gravy in fact. Let us know what you decide on and how it all turns out mate :D
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Hi roger, ive tried julians base and im not very impressed with it to say the least!, i did cook it twice and still wasnt happy, As curryhell has said kd was a base, a good starter base at that! cbm was a very good base and ive also tried taz'z base and that was very good too, ive played around using various bases and have now got a base sauce that suits me, there are loads of base recipes on here and all i can suggest is go through them each week, give them marks out of ten for each one you cook, if it works work around that to suit you.
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I've used the C2GO base and made some really great curries. Previously I've used CAs base again with great success.
This week I've tried a base from a new book, Curry Craft, released in December by the owner of a local BIR in my town. Made a jalfrezi and rogan josh tonight using it. Jalfrazi was nice but my wife said the rogan josh wasn't as nice as usual.
Will try a madras next with this new base to see how that goes. If not too good then will go back to C2GO or CAs base.
Chris
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I have tried Julian's base gravy with good success. I'm wondering who CA is though so that I can try that one to compare . Thanks
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CA is Cory Ander
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CAs base is http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php/topic,3772.0.html (http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php/topic,3772.0.html)
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Thanks for reply chaps, on my wifes advice/instruction! due to the fact people I am cooking for this weekend have not eaten here before I will stick to KD for now. Better the devil you know and all that, but will try different one next time. But I am still confused!
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Thanks for reply chaps, on my wifes advice/instruction! due to the fact people I am cooking for this weekend have not eaten here before I will stick to KD for now. Better the devil you know and all that, but will try different one next time.
I don't think you can go wrong with KD, Dodgy : I have served KD-based curries to many people, and all have been extremely complimentary, both in terms of authenticity and of taste.
** Phil.
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Some weeks ago I was lucky enough to be invited onto the kitchen of my local t/a and watched them cook a chicken madras and was surprised to see no spice or salt added to the dish :o When I asked the chef about this he said 'everything is in the gravy,nothing extra is needed' ??? he also used no oil at the start of the curry and instead used a chef's spoon of base and fried this down before starting with the g/g etc etc.
I asked if I could make my lamb madras and he agreed,I started with a small amount of veg oil plus added about a heaped teaspoon of mix powder ( to his disapproval ;D ) when finished I tasted both and my curry was best ;D
Whether this 'all in the base' is a relatively recent practice I don't know but it might explain why t/a curry's seem to be
lacking in flavour compared to even a year ago :-\
I saw on local Midlands TV a year or so ago about there being a shortage of skilled curry chefs due to recent immigration restrictions. The article showed how a young white lad was given a job knocking out curries in a Local TA. I think some Chefs/Owners are trying to de-skill to process by making batches of curry sauce that can be converted to dishes by someone with relatively minimal skills & training. Just a thought!. I've really noticed a general decline in quality in recent years (from the golden era of late70's/early 80's)
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I've really noticed a general decline in quality in recent years (from the golden era of late70's/early 80's)
It's got nothing to do with inexperienced trainees joe36, white or otherwise. It's down to increased competition hitting the bottom line and corners being cut as a consequence. That and the use of Patak's pastes (something increasingly being peddled on this forum, sadly) have killed the BIR flavour.
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It's got nothing to do with inexperienced trainees joe36, white or otherwise. It's down to increased competition hitting the bottom line and corners being cut as a consequence. That and the use of Patak's pastes (something increasingly being peddled on this forum, sadly) have killed the BIR flavour.
Could not agree more SS, I think now It's all about quantity and to hell with the quality, A lot of BIR's are really sub-standard to how they used to be 70's/80's, such a shame :'(
Les
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Personally I think both reasons are inculpated, but fear that the former (immigration legislation) is more the root of the problem than increased competition.
** Phil.
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Whatever the reasons, it's getting harder and harder to find a decent BIR curry these days - old school or otherwise.
For the last 15 years or so, whenever I visited relatives in London, I used to salivate at the thought of hitting the Tandoori Garden in Lillie Road, Fulham. The chef there made absolutely an absolutely sublime, to die for Madras and vindaloo (the best I've had in the south, in fact), and the rest of the dishes on the menu were great, too. Tarka dhal nice and thick and garlicky - none of your watery soup-like rubbish. Really smokey, flavoursome saag bhaji, superb tandoori chicken, etc, etc. The man had the touch, and it was heaven.
But the last time I went it had all changed. The chef had left, the decor modernised - and the food ruined. It was bloody awful, in fact.
I wish I could find out where he moved to, as I'm now running out of places to find good quality curries.
One thing is for sure, and that is a really good BIR chef is gold dust.
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I'm a newbie to this site.However,I have been trying to find the Holy Grail of BIR sauces for as long as I can remember(a loooong time!).
I'm 59(PHEW!)
Yes,I make Julian's BIR curry gravy all the time,a pressure cooker full at a time.I then freeze it in cheap plastic tubs.
I must say that I do not have a n other base gravy to compare it to,at least not one where I have followed a recipe.
Julian's base gravy is very good indeed-in my opinion,the best yet.I do find,however,that it takes me about 4hrs in total to make a panful.There is no shortcut in cooking out the onions and I believe this is the key.
I'm still trying to tweak things and I'll let you all know if I can improve on Julian's recipe!
Byee.
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Hey Salvador, I know what you mean about having difficulty finding a good take away or restaurant. I think over the years, quality has diminished. I think in our area (Stoke on Trent), I would say that there are around 3 or 4 really good ones out of around 30 or so. I would say that the curries I make are better than most I buy, and I never thought I would be able say that. I'm so glad I found this site. ;D
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Julian's base gravy is very good it takes me about 4hrs in total to make a panful.There is no shortcut in cooking out the onions
You say however you use the pressure cooker method, surely not 4 hours? Is it that your pressure cooker is low pressure and does not DO the onions to THAT stage quicker than it should if a stronger psi? I have tried a few bases now and always come back to Julian's with just the odd 'tweak' of my own. I use my 7l cooker but scale down to a 3l base so that I am not far short of the 7 l once watered down. That gives me almost 25 portions of base each time to freeze.
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I have only ever used Julians base the Bangladesh version from the ebook where I learnt it.
I did not measure the coriander right but have now sorted this out with my last base.
I only do a 1.5 liter at a time but I'm going to do a 3 liter as I seem to go through the stuff!
Iv even got onion bhajj oil that smell's sweet and an aluminum fry pan.
Iv only been curry making for 2 months now and in total I have made around 5.25L of this stuff and includes a 750ml I did first.
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I have only ever used Julians base the Bangladesh version from the ebook where I learnt it.
I did not measure the coriander right but have now sorted this out with my last base.
I only do a 1.5 liter at a time but I'm going to do a 3 liter as I seem to go through the stuff!
Iv even got onion bhajj oil that smell's sweet and an aluminum fry pan.
Iv only been curry making for 2 months now and in total I have made around 5.25L of this stuff and includes a 750ml I did first.
Sounds like you are well on the way then ;)
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Just need Tandoori Oven!
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RubyDoo I need you!
RubyDoo does the 3L you made then go on to make 7L. I am using julian's base too and when it reduces down after being cooked I refill it with water to make 3L.
maybe I have the wrong consistency.
Does julian's 3L make 3L for you.
I have a big pot that has litre mesurments in side the pan ;D
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RubyDoo I need you!
RubyDoo does the 3L you made then go on to make 7L. I am using julian's base too and when it reduces down after being cooked I refill it with water to make 3L.
maybe I have the wrong consistency.
Does julian's 3L make 3L for you.
I have a big pot that has litre mesurments in side the pan ;D
Wasp. I use a 7l pressure cooker. Sometimes as a PC and but normally as an ordinary pan using different lid. I fill this pan to just over half way with onions then add the other to start. When base is done I top up with water to getvright consistency. This brings it to around 6 litres or a little over. Doing the second stage it reduces slightly so I just add water as / if necessary. When Julian says 3 litre he means a three l pot full of onions to start. Can't get the lid on until it reduces slightly. The reason I do not fill my 7 l is purely storage of 14/15 litres when complete.
Hope this helps
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I find that a 7 litre pressure cooker pretty much filled with all the veg and water before cooking produces around 3 litres of finished base.
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I find that a 7 litre pressure cooker pretty much filled with all the veg and water before cooking produces around 3 litres of finished base.
Something very wrong there Meg. Either you are putting water in at the wrong time or your stats are wrong to start with. How can a full 7 l pan full of veg only produce 3 l finished base? Not sure what / when you mean re the water .
Is it me ? ;). A 7l start like that should produce around 14 litres finished base , give or take. In my case probs a bit more.
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Is it me ? ;). A 7l start like that should produce around 14 litres finished base , give or take. In my case probs a bit more.
Que ?! You can't get a quart out of a pint pot, nor can you get 14 litres of base out of a 7L pressure cooker unless you dilute it retrospectively. What am I missing ?
** Phil.
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I follow CAs base (with a few of my own mods), but increase quantities by around 25%. This pretty much fills my pressure cooker. By the times it's cooked and blended, it's only around half full. This seems about right to me - CAs original recipe says it makes 2.3 litres. Makes sense doesn't it?
Ruby, your base must be very thin and watery? ;D
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Is it me ? ;). A 7l start like that should produce around 14 litres finished base , give or take. In my case probs a bit more.
Que ?! You can't get a quart out of a pint pot, nor can you get 14 litres of base out of a 7L pressure cooker unless you dilute it retrospectively. What am I missing ?
** Phil.
Phil, a 3 litre base for example then gets diluted to twice the starting quantity. Ie 3 l is the size of the pot to start crammed with veg etc, very little water. You double it, ish.
Easier explained perhaps if you view the video or read the book although I would have you would have done one of these by now.
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I follow CAs base (with a few of my own mods), but increase quantities by around 25%. This pretty much fills my pressure cooker. By the times it's cooked and blended, it's only around half full. This seems about right to me - CAs original recipe says it makes 2.3 litres. Makes sense doesn't it?
Ruby, your base must be very thin and watery? ;D
Er, still something wrong. CA is not Julian. Yes, the base should be watery, like milk. Look at the vids etc. I have also done a CA base. Many rate it. It was not for me and followed to the letter is too thick.
Some confusion here me thinks between bases? Are you doing Julian's. ( C2G ) or CA's?
;)
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Sorry, this post is about Julians base - I did forget!!
But I was just posting my thoughts on the quantity of the base I get as one of the earlier posters was questioning volume/water/quantities, etc.
Julians was the first ever base I tried - maybe I got it wrong, but I found it too spiced, which came across in the curries I cooked. I seem to prefer a milder spiced base.
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Sorry, this post is about Julians base - I did forget!!
But I was just posting my thoughts on the quantity of the base I get as one of the earlier posters was questioning volume/water/quantities, etc.
Julians was the first ever base I tried - maybe I got it wrong, but I found it too spiced, which came across in the curries I cooked. I seem to prefer a milder spiced base.
Perhaps it was too spiced due to the consistency not being right, ie , too concentrated?
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Phil, a 3 litre base for example then gets diluted to twice the starting quantity. Ie 3 l is the size of the pot to start crammed with veg etc, very little water. You double it, ish.
Easier explained perhaps if you view the video or read the book although I would have you would have done one of these by now.
I have indeed, whence the link to the video that I posted yesterday. However, on watching the video again, I now believe that he quietly switches containers during the cut, something I had previously failed to appreciate. The pressure cooker has a black U-bolt handle; the liquidising container has an aluminium U-bolt container with wider spaced rivets. So, how large is that second container ? We don't know, so we can't accurately judge how much base he produces. It is also unclear why he uses a 3-litre pressure cooker for the first phase when he quite clearly does not deploy its lid. Yet he talks about cooking the post-liquidising phase with the lid on. There is a lot unexplained here, including "what volume of undiluted base exists post-liquidising ?". He uses very little liquid (apart from oil) and the vegetables are going to contribute nothing like their original volume in liquid. I suspect, when all is said and done, that you might be lucky to get 4L of base (i.e., 2L of post-liquidised base concentrate diluted 1:1) from the original 3L, filled-to-the-gills-with-vegetables, pressure cooker, but only those who have actually cooked it will know if that is true.
** Phil.
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Phil, a 3 litre base for example then gets diluted to twice the starting quantity. Ie 3 l is the size of the pot to start crammed with veg etc, very little water. You double it, ish.
Easier explained perhaps if you view the video or read the book although I would have you would have done one of these by now.
I have indeed, whence the link to the video that I posted yesterday. However, on watching the video again, I now believe that he quietly switches containers during the cut, something I had previously failed to appreciate. The pressure cooker has a black U-bolt handle; the liquidising container has an aluminium U-bolt container with wider spaced rivets. So, how large is that second container ? We don't know, so we can't accurately judge how much base he produces. It is also unclear why he uses a 3-litre pressure cooker for the first phase when he quite clearly does not deploy its lid. Yet he talks about cooking the post-liquidising phase with the lid on. There is a lot unexplained here, including "what volume of undiluted base exists post-liquidising ?". He uses very little liquid (apart from oil) and the vegetables are going to contribute nothing like their original volume in liquid. I suspect, when all is said and done, that you might be lucky to get 4L of base (i.e., 2L of post-liquidised base concentrate diluted 1:1) from the original 3L, filled-to-the-gills-with-vegetables, pressure cooker, but only those who have actually cooked it will know if that is true.
** Phil.
short answer is no, you get double ish the 3l investment of veg etc. done it a few times now. The book explains as well albeit there are still several inaccuracies in v 4. Using very little water in part 1 accounts for the need to double up with water later before the last boil.
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short answer is no, you get double ish the 3l investment of veg etc. done it a few times now. The book explains as well albeit there are still several inaccuracies in v 2. Using very little water in part 1 accounts for the need to double up with water later before the last boil.
But how can that be, Ruby ? Look at the video at exactly 03:00; this is post-cook, pre-liquidise and still in the 3L pressure cooker -- the pressure cooker is now only 2/3 full, or 3/4 at most (i.e., 2.0--2.25L). Adding 1:1 water will yield 4.0--4.5L.
** Phil.
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short answer is no, you get double ish the 3l investment of veg etc. done it a few times now. The book explains as well albeit there are still several inaccuracies in v 2. Using very little water in part 1 accounts for the need to double up with water later before the last boil.
But how can that be, Ruby ? Look at the video at exactly 03:00; this is post-cook, pre-liquidise and still in the 3L pressure cooker -- the pressure cooker is now only 2/3 full, or 3/4 at most (i.e., 2.0--2.25L). Adding 1:1 water will yield 4.0--4.5L.
** Phil.
Got an early one tomorrow Phil. Will look at vid later and post again. :D
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Phil
I have looked at the vid against the book albeit briefly. Ww already know about anomalies however important examples lie around -
Differing quantities in vid to book
Differing quantities ratios between 15, 7 and 3 litre bases and again when reducing the 3 different bases he explains.
That said, the video is using a 7 litre PC . Now, is that a 7 litre or a 3 litre? ;) He describes a 7 l elsewhere in the book and uses the same one in another vid. It is the same one I have and is deffo 7 litre but I have to agree that the one you refer to looks a bit smaller or is that the way the vid was done? Remember the high sided pans? ;) The quantities he describes therein are for a 7 litre Bangla base as per book. Eg 500 ml oil. Whole bunch coriander etc.
The book does say transfer base to larger pot and double volume with water. He does not mention this in vid, it just appears in the new pot.
Big further discrepancy for me between vid and book is in the vid he doubles with water and blends then adds spices before next cook. In the book the spices are added before the water and before blending and cooked 30 mins. He does say transfer to 15l pot which is clearly the second one in the video.
Not sure any of this helps re the quantity issue but having made this several times and to repeat -
I use a 7 litre pot but only fill to a tad over half. After boil and spices cooked i add water to around the 6 litre mark . My pan is graduated. After blending and last boil I normally have to add another .25 to .5 litre water to get the constancy right following some reduction. So, I produce 6 litres or a little over from a tad over 3 litres ( spacial ) of starting ingredients raw in the pan. At least Julian clearly shows the desired consistency in the vid! Something very helpful and which cannot be described in a book ( like the 'smell' ).
Hope this makes sense. Not at my best at this time of the day. Must end though by saying that the vid and book are far better read / watched in conjunction with each other.
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Another point just occurred to me. You double the starting 'level' of veg in the pan with water not the level it has reduced to after first boil as you suggest. Big difference. :)
HOLD THE FRONT PAGE!!!!!!!!
Now I have woken up properly - Phil - I think you are looking at a different video and indeed I was looking at the same one as you to start with.
ie this - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5x4oIVzfQZ4 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5x4oIVzfQZ4)
Much clearer within the latest links from v4 of the ebook.
Links removed so as not to get CRO in any trouble.
Apologies for not recognising this earlier. Could have saved a lot of needless typing by both of us and also prevented confusing others perhaps.
Off now to do a 3.25 litre batch in my 7 l pan to produce around 6.25 litres of finished base. ;) :o :-*
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Hope I am allowed to post those links. If not then hopefully somebody will put me right and I will remove or admin can.
EDIT. Sorted.
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Another point just occurred to me. You double the starting 'level' of veg in the pan with water not the level it has reduced to after first boil as you suggest. Big difference. :)
Big difference indeed, but that is not what Levitish says. His exact words are :
... take the equal quantity of your your gravy mixture as blended and then add the same amount of water to it, then you'll end up with this amount. Now ...
HOLD THE FRONT PAGE!!!!!!!!
Now I have woken up properly - Phil - I think you are looking at a different video and indeed I was looking at the same one as you to start with.
Agreed.
** Phil.
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Another point just occurred to me. You double the starting 'level' of veg in the pan with water not the level it has reduced to after first boil as you suggest. Big difference. :)
Big difference indeed, but that is not what Levitish says. His exact words are :
... take the equal quantity of your your gravy mixture as blended and then add the same amount of water to it, then you'll end up with this amount. Now ...
HOLD THE FRONT PAGE!!!!!!!!
Now I have woken up properly - Phil - I think you are looking at a different video and indeed I was looking at the same one as you to start with.
Agreed.
** Phil.
You have lost me again. Who is Levitish and where is this said? Save me going through all the vids again. ;)
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RD,
Levitish = Julian
:)
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You have lost me again. Who is Levitish and where is this said? Save me going through all the vids again. ;)
"Leviteish" is Julian's YouTube name, and the statement occurs at 4:30 in the first video you cite :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=5x4oIVzfQZ4 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=5x4oIVzfQZ4)
** Phil.
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You have lost me again. Who is Levitish and where is this said? Save me going through all the vids again. ;)
"Leviteish" is Julian's YouTube name, and the statement occurs at 4:30 in the first video you cite :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=5x4oIVzfQZ4 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=5x4oIVzfQZ4)
** Phil.
Understood and got it Phil. Ta. Really doesn' t help does it because that 1st video hardly bears any resemblance to what he does in the 1st of the three linked to v4. Especially adding spices before or after water / blending.
Think I will rest on this one. Hope Chris is taking note of all this.. ;)
Back to my base on the stove now.
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Think I will rest on this one. Hope Chris is taking note of all this.. ;)
Agreed. I will do likewise.
Back to my base on the stove now.
Made what I had hoped would be an exceptionally nice Madras yesterday, having (for the first time) used a potli ka masala in the base (later transferred to the pulao rice). Sadly had yet another senior moment and put in three tablespoonsful of Bolsts rather than three teaspoonsful : result -- a considerably thicker curry than I would have wished. Sigh.
** Phil.
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Think I will rest on this one. Hope Chris is taking note of all this.. ;)
Agreed. I will do likewise.
Back to my base on the stove now.
Made what I had hoped would be an exceptionally nice Madras yesterday, having (for the first time) used a potli ka masala in the base (later transferred to the pulao rice). Sadly had yet another senior moment and put in three tablespoonsful of Bolsts rather than three teaspoonsful : result -- a considerably thicker curry than I would have wished. Sigh.
** Phil.
Oh dear. At least Bolsts not too hot ;). Trying a combined version of Julian's base here at the mo. smells good, which is worrying as a base should not in my opinion smell this good unless it is from Glasgow of course. ;) ;). Will update once watered down and blended. On 30 minute cook right now.
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Oh dear. At least Bolsts not too hot ;). Trying a combined version of Julian's base here at the mo. smells good, which is worrying as a base should not in my opinion smell this good unless it is from Glasgow of course. ;) ;).
Strangely enough, exactly the opposite thought occurred to me after O/D'ing on the Bolsts : There has to be an optimal ratio of powdered spice:base (for any given base) which yields the perfect consistency; so if one wants to create a curry with additional flavour, one cannot add additional powdered spice because the resulting sauce will be too thick. So the only way to achieve additional flavour is to infuse it into the base in the first place. WDYT, Ruby ?
** Phil.
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Hope I am allowed to post those links. If not then hopefully somebody will put me right and I will remove or admin can.
Lets hope Julian doesn't see the links you have put up, you may find yourself in court (copyright) :-X
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Hope I am allowed to post those links. If not then hopefully somebody will put me right and I will remove or admin can.
Lets hope Julian doesn't see the links you have put up, you may find yourself in court (copyright) :-X
Exactly why I asked. Many of his vids are open to all to view on youtube. Just do a search. What I do not know is whether some in the book can be posted or not. Again over to admin or moderator for advice. As far as court goes, best of luck. ;)
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Hope I am allowed to post those links. If not then hopefully somebody will put me right and I will remove or admin can.
Lets hope Julian doesn't see the links you have put up, you may find yourself in court (copyright) :-X
Exactly why I asked. Many of his vids are open to all to view on youtube. Just do a search. What I do not know is whether some in the book can be posted or not. Again over to admin or moderator for advice. As far as court goes, best of luck. ;)
(http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/pics/640e2d231fa8940d328dafb411c331dd.JPG)
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That is appreciated. One link left as globally available. I have modified the original post so as no to bring CRO into any disrepute and in the thus far absence of the requested guidance by admin or mod etc. ;) likewise not wishing to upset Julian. ;)
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Technically, you are not redistributing any content unless you download it and upload it again ... Posting a link to an already existant video is not redistribution.
But that's a moot point ;)
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Technically, you are not redistributing any content unless you download it and upload it again ... Posting a link to an already existant video is not redistribution.
But that's a moot point ;)
Thank you Stonecut. Hence my comment regarding 'best of luck re court' but for the sake of keeping the peace all around and not side tracking the thread I thought it best to remove the three ' offending ' links and no point in getting embroiled in distribution or redistribution either. ;)