Topic: First curry using ?hotel base?

[Robbo141]

So I made Green Chilli Chicken tonight, utilizing the hotel restaurant base recipe from Romain?s Glebe Kitchen and it was very good. So good that I forgot to take a pic, but have this shot of tomorrow?s elevenses which I can guarantee will be done before 10am.


Looks a little oilier than normal but I added 1/2 TBSP ghee to the recipe as I thought it was a little dry when frying the spices. I was probably wrong but no harm.

Definitely not BIR but definitely tasty dinner.  Five more portions to go and determined to get through them in the next 10 days.  Don?t judge my chipped bowl.

Robbo

[livo]

Looks the goods Robbo.  I'm keen to try some of the Hotel Style gravies.  The OTM (Bhuna) "Gravy" I'm about to make this afternoon to try Hugoboss' alternative base gravy (close to anyway I hope) is actually one of the Hotel style gravies anyway so I'll do a decent one and experiment with it all.

[Alchemist]

I

[Robbo141]

I agree alchemist, I don?t think it?s superior but definitely different. I?ve made two curries with it now and both results were very nice.  Not BIR at all, but tasty dishes nonetheless.  Tonight?s dinner is from last nights cook and will no doubt benefit from overnight in the fridge.  I?ve been using raw chicken, not pre-cooked and the juices from the chicken do seem to loosen up / dilute the base gravy very well.  The texture of the finished dish was good enough for me.
Four more portions to pull from the freezer. Next will be vindaloo.

Robbo

[livo]

There Is a small problem with "Hotel style" gravies. Searching about the Web turns up multiple sources of the gravies with different experts claiming anything between 4 and 10 different flavours. Trying to find any recipes that then use these gravies is a different matter. The same experts who show how to make gravies inevitably go on to show all of their dishes made from scratch, not using the gravies.

This is a common occurances and anything directly related to using the gravies is simply missing.

Yesterday, I did make an absolutely wonderful Shahi Chicken Korma from a hotel white base gravy. I also used it with some Makhani gravy to make Malai Kofta sauce which was delicious as well.  I made the koftas the day before. Both were my own creations after close examination and extrapolation from selected standard recipes.  The Korma I made was easily my best ever by leaps and bounds and nothing like BIR.  A lot of work but we'll worth it.  My recipe is available if anyone is interested.  I remembered to take notes while I still recalled my ingredients and steps.

I have found 1 place that advises on the combinations of gravies to obtain different "dishes" but it's a bit "Indian" in nature and I'm a little sceptical, but the site does give the same dishes from scratch as well which it says are not as good but quicker.  There may be something worth investigation here.

Edit,  it has just dawned on me that the Aussie IR lessons of Masala Mark from 2010 are in fact very much 'hotel style'.  It's a shame his recipe set was never finished.  I've made his 3 gravies a few times and they are now well worth another visit.

[Peripatetic Phil]

There Is a small problem with "Hotel style" gravies. Searching about the Web turns up multiple sources of the gravies with different experts claiming anything between 4 and 10 different flavours. Trying to find any recipes that then use these gravies is a different matter. The same experts who show how to make gravies inevitably go on to show all of their dishes made from scratch, not using the gravies.  This is a common occurances and anything directly related to using the gravies is simply missing.

I am afraid that I was extremely cynical when these so-called "hotel-style" gravies started to appear.  I do not doubt for one second that such a thing exists, but the very fact that having been a closely-guarded secret until (probably) less than a year ago, all of a sudden every man and his dog started to describe them.  I was not impressed when they first started to appear, and I am no more impressed now.  Maybe perpetual motion is possible (tho' I doubt it), but I am 100% certain that none of the videos on Youtube that purport to demonstrate perpetual motion actually do so.

** Phil.

[livo]

I'm not so sure that this is a new thing or a furphy Phil. My chef aquaintance, K, has referred to different gravies in the past but I've never pressed him about it.  He just adopted a funny smug grin when I mentioned BIR base gravy. I'll see if I can get a bit more from him.

Training in Indian hotels may well involve an understanding of how these gravies are actually used. The mere fact that it isn't well known to us yet doesn't necessarily mean it isn't there and it isn't beyond belief that hotel chefs use bulk preparations instead of traditional home scale cooking.

Some of the information I've found isn't recent going back to 2012 and Masala Mark's posts of the very similar methods were back in 2010.  Certainly the Shahi Chicken Korma dish I made yesterday was superior to any I've made previously.

[Peripatetic Phil]

[...] The mere fact that it isn't well known to us yet doesn't necessarily mean it isn't there

I agree.  In fact, I agreed with that in my earlier message.

and it isn't beyond belief that hotel chefs use bulk preparations instead of traditional home scale cooking

Also agreed.

Some of the information I've found isn't recent going back to 2012 and Masala Mark's posts of the very similar methods were back in 2010.  Certainly the Shahi Chicken Korma dish I made yesterday was superior to any I've made previously.

OK, but when is the first mention of "hotel-style gravies" (in a BIR/IIR context) that you can locate that actually uses those words (or a variant thereof) ?  The first time they came to my attention is when Romaine/Glebe Kitchen started describing them, which was not very long ago ...

** Phil.

[livo]

https://indianzaiqa.wordpress.com/

2012, Indian cuisine chef based in London, trained in Taj group of hotels. 6 main basic gravies used separately and combined to produce different dishes.

This is the most comprehensive explanation I've been able to find so far.  There are no recent updates on the site.

By this man,  https://www.thestaffcanteen.com/Editorials-and-Advertorials/10-minutes-with-gulrez-iqbal-head-chef-at-chakra-kensingston#/

[romain]

OK, but when is the first mention of "hotel-style gravies" (in a BIR/IIR context) that you can locate that actually uses those words (or a variant thereof) ?  The first time they came to my attention is when Romaine/Glebe Kitchen started describing them, which was not very long ago ...

** Phil.

Phile,

Just popping in because I heard I had come up here. The hotel naming is a bit of a western perspective. I used it because I target a western audience and needed a way to frame it in a way that could be understood. Consider for a second that in India maybe it's just gravy and go from there...

Care or don't. Be impressed or not. Compare it to perpetual motion or don't (not sure what that has to do with anything but OK). It's just a different approach. One that appeals to my tastes. Perhaps not to yours but "vive la difference".

Now that I'm tracking it I'm seeing it a more. As an example - Dishoom (a book you might want to pick up - a lot of real wisdom to be gleaned as well as wonderful photography and just a fun read) shares "hotel" technique although they don't call it hotel style.

It's not new. There are videos from over 10 years ago if you drop the hotel nomenclature. 10 years is a very long time in YouTube timelines...