Topic: New Base Gravy from visit to Saffron

[mickdabass]

yeah desiree are ok too.Obviously if they are going to be liquidised, then the disintergration bit is probably irrelevent. I just thought I would give you all the benefit of my knowledge of wholesaling potatoes around Brum!

[JerryM]

matt,

interesting on the side dishes - i suspect your right.

mickdabass,

i spotted the desiree in ASDA today but alas no Romano - i think i can probably get from my local Asian store - is there much difference though

[SnS]

Regarding a recent post relating to a proposed 'modified' Saffron base (and the potential subsequent repercussions of the possibilty of drying out the base in favour of taste) ...

This also applies to other bases.

Full thread here:

http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php/topic,2603.0.html

Specific post here (many thanks to Josh for a great post):

http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php/topic,2603.msg23892.html#msg23892

When you add base, if the base is thick and lacks water (as can happen if you dissapate most of the water by overcooking the base in an attempt to achieve a taster, thicker 'soup'?) then it may be too thick to 'water down' the curry and the boiling process (cooling) is replaced with a frying process (higher temp).

The secret is to add (hot) water (as Stew has found with his recent Jalfrezi) ... or add more watery base.

Stews Jalfrezi here: http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php/topic,2664.msg23549.html#msg23549

Adding more of the original watery 'Saffron base' would make the curry thinner and more fluid. Adding a thicker version of the Saffron base (or other) will also require addition of water (which counteracts the creation of a thicker base (for purpose of taste) in the first place).

There is a very fine line between a 'tasty curry soup' and a 'versatile curry base', and in my opinion (for what its worth), if the base tastes really nice (almost a curry sauce), then it is too rich and is not suitable as an 'all round' curry base.

Conclusion: for now, leave the Saffron base as it is - it may not taste great but the water has a part to play in the final stages.

Best regards
SnS

[JerryM]

i've not read the listed posts yet but they will not change my view:

There is a very fine line between a 'tasty curry soup' and a 'versatile curry base', and in my opinion (for what its worth), if the base tastes really nice (almost a curry sauce), then it is too rich and is not suitable as an 'all round' curry base.

for me this is absolutely crucial - the base must be sort of bland and runny - SnS words above describe what's needed best.

I think the reason is down to leaving room for the addition of the spice mix and having enough water in the base to enable the cooking stage.

For me the saffron base as is ? is spot on. The water called for in the recipe ?Add 1 litre of water. The gravy will now resemble a very thin soup.? is a crucial step.

[Bobby Bhuna]

Yeah, I'm on board with this one. Thin bases are where it's at.

[mickdabass]

matt,

interesting on the side dishes - i suspect your right.

mickdabass,

i spotted the desiree in ASDA today but alas no Romano - i think i can probably get from my local Asian store - is there much difference though

Very little actually

[mickdabass]

i spotted the desiree in ASDA today but alas no Romano - i think i can probably get from my local Asian store - is there much difference though

Very little really

[mickdabass]

I've just finished the Saffron Gravy recipe, and I must say it has produced the best BIR tasting curry for me so far.
Its only the third different base I have tried. The first was Darth Phalls, and the second one I dont recall the author (soz), but it included filling a 7 1/2 litre pot up with onions and infusing the oil overnight with spices and using a mooli root (excellent ingredient). Both have produced brilliant results, but after reading all the interest in the Saffron Gravy recipe; I thought I'd give it a try.
 I didnt weigh the onions, but used fourteen medium english onions. I put in slightly more g&g - about two teaspoons. After adding the extra 1 litre of water,I was worried about the soup-like thickness of the sauce and the apparent lack of oil on the surface, so I continued the final vigorous simmering for an hour while I read a few more posts in this thread.
After leaving to cool down slightly, I scraped off the scum and I was amazed by how much oil had risen to the surface. I initially reclaimed the oil, but after further investigation I decided to stir it back in to the gravy and then bagged it up into 8 x 500ml portions. It looked beautiful in the bags- the oil created a lovely marbling effect ;D
I initially reclaimed about 400ml of oil from the 600 ml I started with.
One thing I have noticed from the recipe is that none of the spices are exposed to high cooking temperatures. (It makes me wonder if that is why there is such a tremendous depth of flavour to the finished dish).I then made a mild curry based on Curry Kings Lamb Bhuna Recipe using 2 medium onions, four lamb steaks pre-cooked as per Curry Kings recipe http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=1915.msg16602#msg16602  ,half a green pepper and a chile. I fried the onion, green pepper and chile in 4 tablespoons of reclaimed oil + 4 tablespoons of fresh oil until the onion started to go brown, added 2 tsp fresh garlic + 2 tsp fresh finely chopped ginger 2 tablespoons of tomato puree (ever tasted this stuff? its sooo sweet), 4 tsp Bruce Edwards spice mix, 1 tablespoon salt, but the mix was too dry and started to stick to the bottom of the pan so I quickly added half a cup of water and the let it reduce down a bit. I then added half a ladle of gravy. Wow..... The smell was amazing. I then put a good pinch of coriander and a good pinch of some fresh methi from out of my freezer bag, and then slowly added the rest of the gravy one ladle at a time.I finished it off with 2 fresh tomatoes quartered. In fact it is almost identical to Curry Kings Lamb Bhuna Recipe!!! The curry had so much depth of flavour and the lovely sweet tang that reminded me of one of my old favourite BIR curries - a lamb masalla...well how a masalla used to taste some twenty or so years ago. IMHO they now all seem to have  the same sickly - sweet bland coconut taste...yeeuch.

Thanks for the superb recipe sns

mick

[joshallen2k]

Interesting post Mick. Begs the question on whether the oil should be reclaimed, and how much. From the number of BIR demo posts on the forum, this does seem to be BIR practice. Using the reclaimed oil is in my experience, a definite plus over fresh veg oil. Aroma and depth of taste are appreciably improved. That said, from the 600ml in my last batch of Saffron, I probably got back 500ml of it, and the marbling that Mick describes was gone.

On the downside (if it is one) the additional cooking time required to get the base to release this much oil (about 2.5 hours at a very slight simmer) does evaporate *some* of the liquid out of the base, though certainly still soup-like.

Some quick math also tells me that the reclaimed oil should last the life of the base, which would be consistent with a BIR who may use reclaimed oil with every curry.

I'm for it, until taste says otherwise. That said, I'm sure there are those that will disagree with me 

Josh

[JerryM]

Mickdabass,

excellent post.

i like think u've hit on another advantage (is there more) of the saffron base - it's versatility - i do use scales but sometimes u can't help putting in a bit more or a bit less, i've even added red pepper. for some reason this base is able to take it all and still produce the business.

I was worried about the soup-like thickness

don't be u need this thin soup-like consistency for the cooking as u end up otherwise adding water at the cooking stage.

I decided to stir it back in to the gravy

this is where i have very set views - the reclaim is a must - with the oil still in the sauce the taste falls very short of what it tastes like with the oil reclaimed - obviously this depends on how much oil has been put in and i feel the max amount to stay in to be 150ml or thereabouts (in 4.5L finished volume).

Josh,

on the evaporation during the extra simmer i feel it's essential to add back water to maintain the original volume - i think i added back at least 1.5L.

i'm going to put the leftover reclaim oil into my next base.

going to have to have a look at CK's Lamb Bhuna though - i love his CTM.