Topic: New here, looking forward to contributing!

[spiceyokooko]

Hey folks

New here and thought I'd introduce myself.

I've 'browsed' a few of the threads at random and was impressed by what I read, so I thought I'd join and learn some new techniques and skills and who knows perhaps even pass some on as well I'm not really a beginner at this, I've been at it for some time.

My love of Indian food started 30 years ago at the 'Star of India' in Brompton Road, run at the time by the TV Chef Reza Mahammad's parents before Reza finally took it over when they retired and turned it into a fancy dancy up market restaurant. I've been eating and cooking (well trying to cook!) Indian food ever since and like I'm sure many of the contributors here trying to get that Indian Restaurant taste and often getting close but never really achieving 'Curry Nirvana'!

I was fascinated to read some of the theories as to what that missing 'x' was, as over the years I've developed my own theories as to what it might be and I don't think my thinking is far off what many here think it is.

I've done the Pat Chapman 'Indian Restaurant Curry Book' many years ago and was pretty disappointed with the results it produced and have subsequently collected many Indian cookbooks over the years I almost have a library of them now!

My breakthrough book was Mridula Baljekar's 'Real Fast Indian Food' where she talks about and gives recipes for 'cook ahead' sauces for 'Madras', 'Khadai' and 'Butter' which in many ways mirror the 'three pot' base sauces used in many Indian Restaurants from which they would then produce a myriad of different flavoured dishes by adding additional ingredients but still only using those three bases sauces as a starting point. The Madras base being obviously for Madras hot type dishes, the Khadai for bhuna type drier dishes and the Butter for Tikka Masala and Korma type creamy dishes. I was fascinated to read on here that many people only ever use once base sauce for all the different styles and types?

I've had great success in producing really good tasting dishes produced from those base sauces, so much so that I really don't bother with Restaurant take-aways any more preferring to cook my own, particularly as I know precisely what goes into the dish and just as importantly I can control exactly how hot they are. Over the years I've moved away from 'fiery-hotness' to subtle depth of flavour.

That's not to say they're as good as or better than Indian Restaurant take-aways, they still don't quite have that 'x' factor, that smokey richness that characterises BIR take-out dishes, but to my taste they're close enough and cheap enough to make - it makes my local take-away redundant! I've just finished a batch of 'slow cooked' lamb madras and I can tell you this much, it doesn't last long in this house!

Is it just me or has anyone else ever noticed how each Indian Restaurant seems to produce it's own 'house' flavour that permeates all the dishes that particular restaurant produces? Not just that it can make all the dishes taste a little 'samey' but also different to another BIR just down the roads 'house' flavour? There's one for the 'x' factor theorists to ponder over and add to the pot of mysteries.

I'd be delighted to post up some of my own recipes for people to try and judge.

Cheers.

[PaulP]

Hi Spicy, welcome to cr0 

I was very interested in your comments about using 3 base sauces. I suspect that my local slightly up-market restaurant might be doing the same, or at least uses 2 bases. Are these sauces ever combined in a single disk I wonder?

I know what you mean about a signature taste that TAs and restaurants often have, sometimes even going as far as the fried rice.

Do please post your recipes when you have time.

Cheers

Paul

[spiceyokooko]

Hey Paul, thanks for your kind welcome.

I'm not really sure whether bases would be combined, I've never combined the one's I make. The reason I think restaurants might use two or three different bases (as opposed to one) is because I just can't see how you could make for example a Tikka Masala AND a bhuna or madras based dish from the same base? The sauce in Chicken Tikka Masala from what I can tell is mostly butter and cream with tomato puree and spices whereas a bhuna would probably be onion and tomato/yoghurt + spices based?

The common denominator that gives all the dishes that 'house' flavour is probably the oil/recovered oil or a small portion of the house based sauce used in the Tikka Masala.

The one base sauce v the three base sauces is an interesting discussion I think as I've always believed most BIR's use the three base sauce system, but that's just my own personal opinion which is part speculation. It's certainly interesting that Baljekar advocates it in her book which is almost entirely geared around producing dishes quickly by producing the three 'base' cook ahead sauces which are then frozen, and used with additional ingredients to produce a number of different dishes which isn't a 100 miles away from how a commercial BIR would produce their dishes.

That's also probably the reason I've independently come to the same conclusion as many on here that the 'x' factor is probably the oil/recovered oil the BIR's use to cook all their dishes in which also produces that 'house' flavour. But again, that's just my own speculation!

I'll upload some recipes in due course as I'm really interested in what people make of them.

Cheers.

[PaulP]

Actually you can make a very wide range of dishes, from korma to vindaloo just using one base sauce, and most TAs and restaurants probably only do use one sauce. I suspect some more upmarket joints may use more than one.

A member on here called masalla mark (I think) did post 3 base recipes from an Australian source. You may like to read these under the base sauces section. One was an onion sauce, one a nut based sauce and the last one a tomato based sauce.

Cheers,

Paul

[natterjak]

Hi sok (ok if I abbreviate you to that?) & welcome to CR0, I really hope you stick around and share some of your experience.  In particular it would be great to get your slow cooked lamb Madras recipe - am I right in assuming it's cooked in a slow cooker?

I've just finished dining on a slow cooked beef curry which I made using a beef brisket in the slow cooker yesterday.  The recipe was from a recipe book and used yoghurt as a base sauce - in fact I didn't really rate the end result too highly but the beef brisket was just to die for, moist and tender and such a great flavour.

I hope you get a lot out of CR0 - please be ready for and ignore the sniping, arguments and petty mindedness which seem to crop up with metronomic regularity.  Just ignore them and engage with the many posters who don't cause trouble here and don't be discouraged. 

[parker21]

hi i posted a 3 pot method back in 2005 but can't find the thread as the search bar does not allow numbers unless more than 2 characters. i said that BIRs use 3 pots  THE BASE and the following masalas to acheived the variety of dishes on the menu!


TANDOORI / TIKKA masala
equal quantities of the following ingredients

tandoori paste(pataks)
tikka paste(pataks)
kashmiri masala(pataks)
ground almonds
coconut powder

add to a bowl and mix well should be vivid red paste. just with the korma masala add what you need to acheive best results,
in pete's demo 1desertspoon was used.
recipe  posted for ctm under heading chicken tikka masala and chicken korma demo

korma masala paste

100ml cream
1tsp garlic puree
1tsp ginger puree
1tbsp ground almonds
2tbsp caster sugar

place all these ingredients in a bowl mix well then add coconut powder until you have a "solid" consistency.
use as little or as much as you need to acheive the results of your own taste.
 anyway guys welcome to cr0 you will find a wealth of knowledge and experience from demos to behind the scene's videos and recipes. all the info is here from regional variations to more traditional indian cookery. and even the odd appearance from BIR chefs lol.

regards
gary

[loveitspicy]

Hi there spiceyokooko welcome!

would be great to read and see you recipes on here! There seems to be an abundance of newbies and not many contributions

best, Rich

[artistpaul]

Hi Spicy, welcome to cr0

Paul

[spiceyokooko]

Actually you can make a very wide range of dishes, from korma to vindaloo just using one base sauce, and most TAs and restaurants probably only do use one sauce. I suspect some more upmarket joints may use more than one.

Hi there Paul

If that's true - it's probably why most Indian Restaurants have a 'house' flavour and the reason why in my opinion so many of the various dishes they produce pretty much taste the same! I guess I've started moving in a different direction - more towards what ordinary Indians might want cook at home rather than merely trying to replicate exactly the BIR dishes we're all so used to eating in the restaurants.

I'm looking forward to trying some of the one base sauce dishes given on this site and comparing them with what I can produce using my three base sauce system! I'd like to see if any of the recipes here make me change they way I'm doing things.

Cheers.

[spiceyokooko]

In particular it would be great to get your slow cooked lamb Madras recipe - am I right in assuming it's cooked in a slow cooker?

Hi there natterjack

It's s'ok if you call me Sok and thanks for the welcome! It'll be interesting to see if anyone figures out my username!

My 'slow cooked' lamb madras is simply simmered in a saucepan over a low flame for 2-3 hours until the meat becomes tender and like your beef brisket, starts to fall apart. I'm going to try cooking this slowly in a clay casserole in the oven at some point and see what affect that has on the flavour.

What was the problem with the flavour of the beef brisket using the yoghurt?

I think you get sniping and wum's in all forums of this type really - wherever you get differences of opinion. A you rightly point out, it's wise to simply pick and choose which discussions to engage in, but thanks for the heads up.

I'll try and write up the recipe for this lamb madras once I've figured out the right place to put it.

Cheers!