Topic: What do we know about oil in BIR's

[emin-j]

Copied and Paste my post from another thread you might find interesting 


Following this and JerryM's thread http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=8347.0 highlighting MarkJ's thread it got my mind buzzing  I got the mini fryer out of the cupboard and had a good sniff.. Wow ! BIR ! I called the Wife to have a sniff and she confirmed this was exactly the smell that fills the house following us having a takeaway.
So I took a couple of ladles out and put into a dish and had another sniff  yep that's it !
Just made 3 curry's using this oil,put some in the base (approx 75ml) some on the pre cooked chicken,and some in the final curry's.
I have resisted the temptation to scoff the lot  and will reheat tomorrow evening as I want all my senses to be clear from spices as when I would be when buying a takeaway.
I did taste the curry's when adding salt and the taste was promising.
In my previous attempt at using Bhaji oil and if I'm honest the oil was a bit past it and smelt more acrid than BIR !
Will post results tomorrow   

[Whandsy]

I too, am now using bhaji oil. As sceptical as a lot of others, i tasted the oil just after straining it through a sieve and it did indeed taste like onion bhajis,

The last curry i made was CH's NIS, it was also the 1st time i've tried the oil. I have to say i tweaked the dish slightly and used some premade C2G onion sauce instead of prefrying the onions as specified.

I don't know if it was the oil, or the fact that the recipe is top notch, but it was my best effort to date and can honestly say i've reached my curry making goal!
I took the remaining portion straight round to a mates house who also loves his curries and to quote his response "thats as good as your gonna get from any curryhouse". He's tasted a few of my curries now and is not the kind of chap to lie and inflate my ego. Now i have to admit, i dont profess to be able to make the best curry in the land, but it really was THAT good and can honestly say if i can keep delivering that standard of curry, then my goals reached

Was is the bhaji oil or the supernatural curry magic at work? Who know's but long may it continue!! 

W

[natterjak]

Well assuming that bhaji oil turns out to be significant (and that's still to be proven I would say) maybe the next challenge will be to develop a technique to season oil in a quicker & cheaper way than frying 300 bhajis!

[emin-j]

I would like to think that boiling whole spices in oil could match the flavour of Bhaji oil but I've tried that and It didn't have the depth of flavour or aroma of the Bhaji oil 

[curryhell]

I don't know if it was the oil, or the fact that the recipe is top notch, but it was my best effort to date and can honestly say i've reached my curry making goal!

It's my recipe of course   I'm sure the additon of C2G's onion sauce would have made a slight difference to the taste vs the way i precook mine.  But  I doubt the overall flavour would have changed entirely because of it.
 

He's tasted a few of my curries now and is not the kind of chap to lie and inflate my ego. Now i have to admit, i dont profess to be able to make the best curry in the land, but it really was THAT good and can honestly say if i can keep delivering that standard of curry, then my goals reached

Was is the bhaji oil or the supernatural curry magic at work? Who know's but long may it continue!! 

W

No W, it was simply the chef putting it together.  Well done and long may it continue and improve further ;D  As for the bhaji oil, i've yet to be convinced that it is essential to achieving BIR taste or smell.  The debate on the use of seasoned / reclaimed oil has been going on since this site first started.  It gets discussed, then we explore something else, then we discuss it some more and again go off down another avenue.  Then we come back to it yet again.  Some people swear by it, others will have none of it. 
I've no doubt that many restaurants up and down the country recycle their oil as it reduces costs and will add an additional flavour to the gravy, maybe.  Based on others accounts here of restaurant experiences and my own experiences i'm also sure there are as many restaurants that don't and use only fresh oil.  For those members who know their local BIR uses it I can understand their continued belief in the need for its inclusion and belief that it's one of the essential magical ingredients.  Until several members on here turn round and shout EUREKA - it's all about the recycled / onion bhaji oil, and prove this conclusively, i'm afraid i've no intention of chasing my tail.  But good luck to those who do.
I've recently cooked with bhaji oil (well flavoured i might add as i now get a regualar order for my BIR bhajis)  It didn't make the slightest appreciable difference to the overall taste or flavour of the dish.  I think Unclefrank mentions CBM's method of precooking vegetable, which in my opinion produces a very fine BIR tasting and lovely smelling oil.  Again i've used it and there was no significant step change in the taste of the finished article.  For those that have tried my brinjal bhaji recipe and done it exactly to spec, the oil that remains after you've consumed the aubergine, in my opinion is as good as any you'll get from any other source.  And this is simply achieved by the frying of ginger / garlic mix spice and turmeric and diluted tomato paste.



Like Razor, my opion for what it's worth, is that whilst it will add something, which may be essential for some members, its addition for me and possibly other members is of little significance.
There are plenty of other avenues for me to explore at the moment, particularly in the area of the base gravy (excluding the addition of reclaimed / bhaji oil  ;D).
I'm sure many will disagree but that's my opinion which i'm entitled to.  If someone can provided me with cast iron evidence to the contrary i am only to willing to listen and be persuaded otherwise
 

[Stephen Lindsay]

Well assuming that bhaji oil turns out to be significant (and that's still to be proven I would say) maybe the next challenge will be to develop a technique to season oil in a quicker & cheaper way than frying 300 bhajis!

CA posted a recipe for "making" spiced oil a while back and you can get it from this link:

http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=3295.msg34667#msg34667

Given that this thread is called "what do we know about oil in BIRs" from the posts so far I would have to conclude, "very little" as there seems to be no consensus. I have made curries with fresh oil and bhaji oil and I fall into the camp of not noticing any real difference. My instinct tells me that this is another search for the holy grail which will ultimately end up at the end of a cul-de-sac.

Until someone can prove to that oil DOES make a difference AND can provide a technique will demonstrates this AND one that can be replicated across different curries and different cooks then I remain sceptical.

[emin-j]

I have recently delved into the world of using whole spices hoping to achieve that certain difficult to describe aroma that comes from a good BIR curry and although I have produced some cracking curry's that lingering aroma is still not there  my previous 'Bhaji oil' attempt was a bit of a disaster but that was due to the rancid state of the oil  :
From that point I had dismissed Bhaji oil as being part of the 'Holy Grail' until I again today took some 'Bhaji oil' from my mini fryer,this time it was instantly recognisable  my Wife who is also a curry nut agreed that it was definitely the T/A aroma so this afternoon I made three curry's using the Bhaji oil which will be tomorrow nights tea  it's now 10.30pm and the house is still filled with the aroma of the Bhaji oil.
If this does prove to me that this is the flavour/aroma I have been striving for I then need to work out how the BIR's get this oil into their curry's and my guess would be the base gravy.     

[George]

Hi Mick, it takes the frying of many many Bhaji's to reach the level of flavour required 

Yes, and I think any aroma is probably due more to the frying of onion and flour, rather than spices as such, or perhaps due to a combination of everything together, and certainly not only due to pure spices.

[ELW]

i'm afraid i've no intention of chasing my tail. 

Me neither, why consider bhaji/old /near rancid/burned oil as important, when a wealth of information on here, ie video footage from named restaurants, chefs knowledge, incredibly "experienced amateurs",  & people who have actually worked in bir kitchens, prove otherwise. 

The Zaal info, told me:
The gravy recipe's on cr0 are good to go!
Msg was not added!
Ground spice can be cooked for longer than I was led to believe!
Cooking a dish at home will take slightly longer than the time shown in the professional kitchen videos
The frying stage up to the gravy,has to be done correctly, ie rawness removed
It was all the information I needed to confirm, that everything I need is here & always has been!


Fresh oil / GG or Garlic only /spice/methi/salt/ tomato paste(crucial these are fried properly) / base gravy bir aroma here    - Hard bit over 

The addition of mixed pickle, Banjarra onion paste, any other onion paste,'Magic Sauce', masala / Jhal paste, extra garlic/ginger, tikka meat, chilli sauce, mango chutney, cream, spinach........... is where the complex flavours from. Apologies if this is patronising anyone, but I've never made onion bhajis in my life never mind use the leftover oil

Regards
ELW

Ps - If I found out for sure than my fav bir's used oild fryer oil rather than fresh, I'd find somewhere else to dine  other than penny pinching, there is no need for it

[emin-j]

Just walked in the door from work to a lovely curry cloud wafting around the house BIR ? very close and close enough for me to be convinced the BIR taste/aroma is brought about by the oil, the flavour of the curry definitely had the BIR flavour about it but the flavour was a little too strong but as I used the oil in the base,precooked chicken and final dish I'm not surprised  : the only thing that seemed to be missing was the fragrant spices and maybe I should have used the Zaal base which I had added the whole spices,instead I used curry2go base.
My next plan is to put Asian bay leaves,green cardamom,cinnamon and star anice into my mini fryer,this should flavour the Bhajis plus give me a flavoured oil with the fragrant spices playing their part.
Next time I will only add the Bhaji oil to the base gravy and see how that goes,I do think this is worth investigating ..again  :