Topic: YUCK! Disgusting!

[underwurlde]

1st attempt was unfortunately DISGUSTING!

 

I tried this curry base:
http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=674.0
With a good pre-meat recipe (this went OK, so I'll move on).

My 1st attempt was a Madras... simple enough I thought!

Heated 6 tbsp of oil until it was very hot, bunged in the spices for 20 secs, followed by some garlic paste and tomatoe puree, quickly followed by some base and the meat.

What I ended up with was not very flavoursome at all, VERY VERY dark brown horriblest curry I have EVER made. Yuck!

My conclusions: I think I have burnt something somewhere. I cannot explain why the curry I ended up with looked so horribly dark brown. I think it may have been the tom puree.

Also, I do NOT think that particular base is for the Madras type curries, to me the consistency is more akin to Korma / Massala dishes, hence to make matters worse this crap I cooked up just now was also stodgy.

Stodgy, dark brown, burnt, crap / no flavour. HORRIBLE.

Damn it! I was soooo looking forwards to a huge improvement....

Whaddya reckon guys, put me right here!  ;D

Andy

[SnS]

Hi Andy

Welcome to the forum and happy Christmas to you (I hope the curry wasn't the Christmas dinner)!

It sounds like you've burnt the tomato puree and maybe the spices and garlic as well. Perhaps the oil was a bit too hot (was it ghee). Why fry the tomato puree - it don't need it? Try adding a little water to the spices to make a paste before plunging into hot oil. This wont stop you frying the spice to release the flavours, but it will help to prevent the spices from burning if the oil is too hot.

This is a copy of what I sent Ast (new member) earlier this week which may be of help.

A proper BIR gravy does not have an array of different vegetables in it - or it is unlikely to give you the true BIR taste. What you'll get is a chef's adaption of a base gravy which may be better or worse than the average BIR. Your preference to what you add to the BASE gravy to suit your particular needs is based on personal taste. This can be only judged through experience, which will only come through trial and error.

It is better to start your experiments with a true base gravy and work from there.

A true base gravy (also known as DAAG) consists of onions, garlic, ginger, tomatoes, oil, salt and a number of spices, primarily coriander, cummin, turmeric and chili. The cooking process of the Daag will vary, as will the amount and the timing of the spices added. Each method will result in different taste. The daag may also contain some fresh sweet peppers, chillies and coriander.

If you want to try a simple base gravy (that can be later adapted to your taste), my advice is not go for a complicated one. Stick to the proven methods.

Although my gravy recipe is not exactly high-tech, it is simple to produce using basic ingredients, not overspiced and does give you the opportunity to create a variety of tasty BIR curries.

http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=2189.0

In my opinion (and I hope others won't take this the wrong way), the base gravy should be very mild and bland and not in the least bit like a curry. Often I see base gravy recipes that have far too many spices added and I wonder whether there is confusion between a curry and base curry gravy.

CA also made a posting about this a little while ago, a lot of what he says makes good sense!

http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=2219.msg18770#msg18770

Rule 1 - Keep the base gravy simple!!!!

Best Regards
SnS :

[mike travis]

Do we take it all went well with the base sauce?  ;D Sounds like you may have burned the spices. I don't usually add spices direct to hot oil. I normally stir fry some onions first then add spices. We have all been there my friend   . Hope it helps..  ;D

[Secret Santa]

Heated 6 tbsp of oil until it was very hot, bunged in the spices for 20 secs...

That was your first mistake. Very hot oil + dry spice powders = nasty burnt taste! You should try to use the oil recovered from the base sauce when you cook that, it adds flavour and will not burn the spices as easily.

There's no harm in adding tomato puree but water it down  to give a runny texture (or alternatively use passata), this will help prevent burning. With the darth base you used I think you could get away with not using any tomato puree at all for a madras, so you could try that.

Only add a small ladle of base sauce to start with an cook this down quite fiercely, then turn the heat down and add as much pre heated base sauce as you think necessary and cook until the chicken is heated through.

If you like your madras a bit sour flavoured add a tbsp of plain yoghurt at the end of cooking. This will also lighten the colour a bit.

It's all a matter of technique but I've certainly been where you are now so give it another try and let us know how you get on.

[Graeme]

"Heated 6 tbsp of oil until it was very hot, bunged in the spices for 20 secs"

No No No....

did you wear goggles :-0

[underwurlde]

Thanks for your replies!

@smokenspices, no that was not our Christmas din-dins thank heavens! I did not use Ghee, I only ever use sunflower oil (as in this case) or olive oil. The base I produced was simple enough IMO, and it was as suggested ?bland?: However its consistency reminded me of Korma / Massala dishes, you know, slightly stodgy.

Yes I was a bit foolish with the heat, I read (rather mis-read) that ?proper? Indian chefs first get the oil very hot / smoking and then you bunged the spices in for 20 secs and then very quickly add the other spices. To date, I have never cooked this way, I would fry some onions for 5 mins, add spices and a splash of boiled water (to stop things sticking to the pan) and then took things from there (I have never created a ?base? curry? first, everything was cooked in the pan as a one-off).

Anyways, lesson learnt there folks!

@mike travis yes, base curry I created from the excellent thread I referenced above was spot on IMO, good consistency, colour, bland taste.

@Secret Santa & Graeme, agreed, obvious now really. I was a bit blinded by my excitement in seeing all of these ideas & techniques and tried to emulate them all in one go!


Anyway, the GOOD news is that using the same base & precook chicken, I went on to create a Chicken Korma for the wife. It is the most accurate Korma I have ever cooked and my wife was well pleased with the result: ?Just like from the Restaurant? she said, ?That?s the general idea!? says I.

So, getting there! I think in the future, lesson learnt with regards the heating of the oil, and I think I?ll be using this base here: http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=1894.0
for Madras as it looks closer / uses ingredients, that more closely match what I use for my previous Madras methods.

Thanks again for all your help!

Andy

[SnS]

I did not use Ghee, I only ever use sunflower oil (as in this case) or olive oil.

Hi Andy

Glad the Korma went okay for "the wife".

Just a small point - avoid using olive oil.

1) It can cause the spices to lose their individual flavours
2) It tends to burn easily at higher temperatures
3) It's more expensive than other "off the shelf" oils

Try to use vegetable or butter ghee, peanut oil, grapeseed oil, mustard oil, groundnut oil, sunflower oil or cornflower oil .... but avoid olive oil.

Best regards

SnS

[underwurlde]

@smokenspices

Thanks again for the tip there!

For my past recipes (life before cr0 that is), I started using olive oil on the recommendations of an Indian work mate who I had been getting many useful cooking tips from (in exchange for Italian and Chinese cookery tips from myself).

My family have never used ghee, always normal oil or even better olive oil

Who was I to argue.... But regardless, I shall avoid it's use from now on and stick to good old sunflower oil. I love it when the best ingredient is the cheapest most commonly available AND healthiest one!

Andy

[fumble]

I normally have several different oils for different purposes.

Olive oil - for salads and dressings. Rarely cook with it.

Sunflower oil - for general use.

Groundnut oil - for stir fries where a high temperature is required.

Toasted sesame oil - as above for extra flavour.

Butter Ghee - for currys where the extra depth is required and sod the cholesterol!

Not forgetting things like butter, Flora, and beef dripping (essential for good roast potatoes!)

[SnS]

Members might find this useful

The Smoke Point (degrees C)

Safflower         265
Sunflower        246 
Soybean          241 
Canola             238 
Corn                 236
Peanut             232 
Sesame            215
Grapeseed       200
Virgin Olive       190 (depending on purity) 
Ex Virgin Olive   160 (depending on purity)

Ghee (butter)     190 to 250 (depending on purity)
Lards              183 to 205 (depending on purity)

Each time you fry with oil, the smoke point is lowered - irreversibly.

Regards
SnS