Topic: Sorry if this is another silly question about base gravy

[Aussie Mick]

Hey NJ

I noticed a sediment on the bottom of the pan when the Taz base seperated. I was actually tempted to pass it through a sieve (Chewy style) but I just stirred it all back in before splitting it up ready for freezing.

I cooked up a mushroom bhajee and a bhuna with it which I really enjoyed. I gave one portion to a mate to try, but he wasn't as keen on it as the CA/Chewy base, and as I said, I have never really managed to get a good oil separation on either of those bases..... Bloody chemistry eh? :

As CA said, it is not too important. All of the curries I've cooked up for friends have been with bases where the oil hasn't really seperated, and there have been zero complaints on the finished dish so far.

[emin-j]

Mick, sounds like a good experiment and I hope no other random variations creep in to threaten the validity of your result.

Emin-j after your well cooked base experience did you notice a kind of sediment at the bottom of the pan?

I'm not sure I've read on here anyone else other than myself experiencing this but in my mind it's synonymous with the base reaching this "fully cooked" stage, when the oil rises. You will see it if you reach a long spoon down to the bottom of the pan and scoop what's there to the surface.

Hi NJ, yes there was some not expected sediment at the bottom of the cooking pot so I just re-blended the base.

[chewytikka]

G'Day Mick
If you start off a base with 400ml or 500ml of oil your going to end up with an oily base, some chefs still like it like that.
If you want a healthier base gravy go with a 150ml to 200ml of oil.
If a base doesn't seem to be giving up its oil, its probably too thick, add some more water.

My answer is the same In your previous thread on the subject, i.e http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=8161.msg71992#msg71992

The second part of my recipe=
To finish it off, you can do it two ways, but either way you have to thin it down with plenty of water.

1. Quick way is to bring it back to a rolling boil with a lid on, important that you give it a stir
every few minutes as the onion sediment gathers on the outer edge at the bottom of your pan
and can overcook. The trick is that the oil will separate and be carried up with the steam. If you
check inside your lid, after say 15 mins, there should be little droplets of oil stuck to it. How long you boil varies,
but once I get a scum forming and an red/brown oil slick around the outer edge of the pan, I turn it down to a simmer and then off.

2. The slow way, is to bring it to the boil then turn down to a low heat simmer, give it a stir
now and then, until you get the scum/oil. ( always keep a lid on until you get the oil)
It doesn't really matter if it doesn't release loads of oil, as once you've scooped most of the scum off,
you should give the pan a good stir and the oil will mix back in.



Just as a point of reference
I've uploaded a video clip of how my finished curry base texture looks.
Not a great deal of oil in there, but I only use 200ml max in my recipe to start with.
And even this finished base could stand another litre of water.
http://www.southtyneside.com/sizzler/finishedbase.html

I think CA's Base recipe was cR0 formulated from information at the time and
doesn't call for a second cook after blending, so obviously there's going to be no oil separation there.

The Taste Test, once you've finished and you have some oil on top.
Take a ladle of base without oil and taste it two or three times, then take another ladle
of base with a bit oil in, mix it well and taste that, two or three times.

You should find quite a difference between the two, then you can decide whether to mix the oil in or not.


Here's some Scientific/Technical Jargon from Mr.google
All about density
1. Because oil has a lower density than water, it will tend to float on top of water, thus creating two distinct layers. Oil and water combine to form an immiscible layer, named because they don't mix together. Oil is also a non-polar molecule compared to water, which is a polar molecule, causing such a separation to occur.
Oil is a nonpolar liquid, meaning that its atoms don't attract the atoms of a polar substance, such as water.

Another explanation here:-
2. Water (H2O) is polar because its oxygen atom pulls on the electrons of its 2 hydrogen atoms, so it has a positive side and a negative side; it and other water molecules naturally attract each other.

On the other hand, oil is composed of hydrogen and carbon atoms. Hydrogen and carbon generally have the same electronegativity, meaning that they equally share the electrons. This lack of a positive side or a negative side makes oil nonpolar, so its atoms and water molecules don't attract each other.

Thus, oil does not dissolve in water but accumulates to form a layer above the water in a container. Since water has a density of 1 g/L (gram per liter) and oil floats on top of water, oil has a density of less than 1 g/L. If a nonpolar substance has a density of greater than 1 g/L, then it would accumulate at the bottom of the water to form a dense layer in the container.

cheers Chewy

[Cory Ander]

I think CA's Base recipe was cR0 formulated from information at the time and
doesn't call for a second cook after blending, so obviously there's going to be no oil separation there.

Not really Cr0 formulated, Chewy; rather a culmination of my learning and experiences (from all manner of sources) at that time.

For what it's worth, the oil does generally separate before blending (whatever that might mean) but, as you correctly say, I don't use a second cook, after blending, so it gets blended back into the base and stays there until the final dish is cooked.

[Aussie Mick]

Yes CA! Thanks for that

I've noticed that each time I've cooked your base.

While the stick blender is doing it's stuff, there is always a red oily splodge at the top of the mixture. To me, that was the message to say that it was cooked.

Thanks Chewy for explaining things again. I'll be cooking up a batch of your base on Friday, so I'll be checking out the links as references along the way. I'll try to remember to take some pictures.